Trap gun fit

Hello I'm new to trap having just done game and sporting. How does one know if a gun fits? I hear it's different to a sporter. Is it correct the mid rib bead should sit just under the end bead when the gun is mounted correctly? Thanks!

That'll do fine for the time being, just make sure it goes in the shoulder pocket, not the arm and mount the gun to the face, not shoulder first.

What 40up said.

The figure of eight with mid bead is a rule of thumb but not written in stone only experience will determine what is right for you.

just to get you started on a journey you may regret

http://www.trapshooters.com/threads/the-gun-shoots-flat-or-high.223964/

Thanks guys. Typically, assuming fig of 8 ok, where should the bead/8 be in relation to the clay when firing. Clay sitting on bead?

didn't read the link, didja?

This imo cannot and should not be answered as a lot depends on your perception of the target and your gun style. Some may tell you that the target will sit on top of the 8 BUT if you are even aware of this you are aiming or rifling the shot and this is not generally done at trap especially fast disciplines. Forget the fig 8 nonsense just take notice of your breaks if your taking the bottom of everything you need a higher comb if your taking the top off you need a lower comb. This imo is the only way to set a trap gun up as unlike a pattern plate this method takes into account your perception and the dynamics of your swing.

As an example attached are a couple of images taken today.

The first was my sons trap gun with a no. 6 Perazzi choke in at 30 yards or so. The cartridge was put directly behind the end (only) bead i.e blotting out the target with the bead. The second picture was my gun (with a 3/4 choke) with the cartridge again behind the bead.

http://www.shootclayforum.com/uploads/monthly_08_2014/post-1056-0-43120600-1407099911.jpghttp://www.shootclayforum.com/uploads/monthly_08_2014/post-1056-0-10660700-1407099927.jpg

In both cases the pattern is 90% above the POA, with the POI about 5 inches above the POA.

The third and fourth images shows the cartridge at the anticipated position of the clay i.e. anticipated position above the bead (same order as above).

http://www.shootclayforum.com/uploads/monthly_08_2014/post-1056-0-57796500-1407099941.jpghttp://www.shootclayforum.com/uploads/monthly_08_2014/post-1056-0-35870000-1407099956.jpg

The fifth images shows the first barrel pattern (3/4 choke) to the left and the second barrel pattern (full choke) to the right of my MX8 with the POA at the level of the cartridge in the middle of the plate.



All patterns are using Fblacks 28 gramme and demonstrate just how tight they pattern through 3/4 and full choke! When I am on them they are smoke! But the tight pattern leaves little margin for error, particularly on straight targets!!

DT

Wonko the Sane said:

didn't read the link, didja?

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Thanks - I did read it but didn't initially make the connection (if you'll excuse the pun)

I realise there is no exact answer but just wanted to get a few pointers to get me started so I'm not completely clueless

Dog - photos are very helpful! Thanks.

COACH, I think would be the operative term in this quest.  JMO of course

Neil said:

Thanks guys. Typically, assuming fig of 8 ok, where should the bead/8 be in relation to the clay when firing. Clay sitting on bead?

Click to expand...

That really depends on what type of trap you will be going to shoot. If you are talking about a fast trap discipline (ABT/UT/OT) then you won't have any time to think about where the bead/barrels are in relation to the target as it is simply moving to fast to actually calculate/see that picture before you should really be firing the shot. 

When I shot DTL (a dark time in my life, ) I would typically cover the target with the barrels and fire but when I eventually got to OT, I skipped ABT altogether for some reason, I was taught to shoot it on instinct. By this I mean that when you call pull you basically point at the target with your "pointing hand", the one which holds the forend whichever handedness you are, and fire. By the time you pull the trigger and the hammer strikes the primer etc etc and everything happens you will be in front of the target with the correct amount of lead and you should break the target because your subconscious brain will have calculated the lead and everything for you in the time it took you to point at the target.  

I have stopped thinking about the bead now. I simply shoot when I think I am in the right place to make the shot and I am doing really well this way. I think it is much more important to make sure that you are looking in the right place to see the target properly when you are about to call it and then move the gun while maintaining good sight of the target and as the gun swings up to the target squeeze the trigger. It is usually at this time I become aware of the gun in relation to the target and when the target breaks I do not really know where the bead as it is an instinctive decision to squeeze the trigger. I have no idea if this is the correct way to go about shooting UT and OT but it seems to work for me and I while happy to be breaking the targets I sometimes fear that I am not shooting properly for some reason?

In summary forget about the beads concentrate on your pre shot set up. That for me is feet, gun mount, gun hold and lastly eye focus for target acquisition then call the target and break it. If you can do that pre shot set up time after time exactly the same from every stand I think you will break more targets in the end. This is only my opinion and my way of shooting fast trap but I would be glad to hear from more experienced trap shooters as to their own particular method, because I sometimes, as I said, worry that I don't even know where I am shooting I just feel or anticipate that it is the right time to make my shot when I do but just now this method of shooting is really working for me.

jwpzx9r said:

as I said, worry that I don't even know where I am shooting I just feel or anticipate that it is the right time to make my shot when I do but just now this method of shooting is really working for me.

Click to expand...

Ian (ips) and I have had a great many conversations about this subject! Quite a bit has been written about it over the years and to go into it deeply can really make the brain hurt! Put simply, it's a case of letting the subconscious run the show, it's not that easy to learn at first and once learned it becomes hard if not impossible to revert back to a previous method of shooting.

it's not that easy to learn at first and once learned it becomes hard if not impossible to revert back to a previous method of shooting.

Les I have been shooting like this since not long after I got the Perazzi and now even though from time to time when I have had a bad round and I have tried at the start to be more conscious of my shooting I go through my set up all the target watch it leave the trap house follow it by eye then move my gun next thing I know bang! shot has been taken with out thinking. Now whether deep down in my sub conscious I have been more diligent and corrected what I thought the fault was I don't know but usually I do get a better score so maybe I have. Another thing that crosses my mind from time to time is that a miss is usually caused by bad set up rather than when the shot was taken. In other words you have set up slightly differently be it feet, mount or focus point and this causes the miss. Sorry about serious thread drift

jwpzx9r said:

it's not that easy to learn at first and once learned it becomes hard if not impossible to revert back to a previous method of shooting.

Les I have been shooting like this since not long after I got the Perazzi and now even though from time to time when I have had a bad round and I have tried at the start to be more conscious of my shooting I go through my set up all the target watch it leave the trap house follow it by eye then move my gun next thing I know bang! shot has been taken with out thinking. Now whether deep down in my sub conscious I have been more diligent and corrected what I thought the fault was I don't know but usually I do get a better score so maybe I have. Another thing that crosses my mind from time to time is that a miss is usually caused by bad set up rather than when the shot was taken. In other words you have set up slightly differently be it feet, mount or focus point and this causes the miss. Sorry about serious thread drift

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John, it's not thread drift really mate! Peter Croft told me many years ago that if the gun fits properly and your set up is correct before you call for the bird, then 95% of the work is already done! You just need to look at the bird and kill it, because everything else is already done!!! If however, gun fit, mount or stance are wrong, well you may as well chuck the gun at the bird!!!

+1

what les said.

Pre shot routine needs to be the same every time. Also focus and mount point needs to be at the optimum point in order to pick the target up correctly this is the bit that needs to be adaptable and this is imo were the skill lies but only experience and knowledge gained can help. So, if set up is correct gun mount and fit is correct hold point is correct focus point is correct then all you have to do is look at the target and pull the trigger, Simples. Except for the fact that a lot can go wrong in the .7th second between calling for target seeing target and pulling trigger.

Les53 said:

Ian (ips) and I have had a great many conversations about this subject! Quite a bit has been written about it over the years and to go into it deeply can really make the brain hurt! Put simply, it's a case of letting the subconscious run the show, it's not that easy to learn at first and once learned it becomes hard if not impossible to revert back to a previous method of shooting.

Click to expand...

I disagree unless you make it successful previous method cuz I know that it is just too easy for me to drift off and start looking at the gun/target thing.

And of course that's a miss 

Many international coaches say see the bead getting closer to the target. Or touch the target