Total Noob 1st Gun

[Oldblaster]

Agree with most posts, don't go too expensive on your first gun, you will soon need to upgrade as your shooting style develops. Chris Potter is a good starting point.

 

[Stiggers]

Hello, so i've semi retired always wanted an O/U 12g for clay shooting only (56yrs old). Have just completed my licencing which took erm 4 months. I'm going shopping, very excited. I don't like to go off half cocked so will be investing so as not to bleed money on trade-ins etc.

my initial budget was about £6k so i have researched and taken advice and will ultimately go to Chris Potter to buy a gun that fits me. So i am thinking stretch to £7k and get a used DT11 or similar, or just spend £4k on a 694 (or similar) and that will be good enough, i dont want to be hankering after something it will annoy me.

or a Koli sport, or a Blaser F3 or a used perazzi lower end model like the MX 2000. I like nice things that are also functional.

is a new mid range gun with warranty better than a higher end gun S/H, it wont get an enormous amount of use.

do i need an adjustable comb?

sorry for the ramble. Cheers

Clays or feathers? If clays then I would recommend the beretta 694 - numerous options and far less than 7K. Again - not sure on your prey but if clays try before you buy.

 

[RussP]

Clays or feathers? If clays then I would recommend the beretta 694 - numerous options and far less than 7K. Again - not sure on your prey but if clays try before you buy.

Hi clays only, have taken the afternoon off going to CPs to have a browse.

 

[Oldblaster]

Browning Pro Sport can't go wrong really, to start and you will in all probability keep it!

 

[RussP]

Sooo, I like the Browning 725 pro sport… I see preloved ones in decent condition for 2300 and less.

or the beretta 694 b fast, which is quite a piece more. Well double as there aren’t any used ones for sale

found the above with TSK for £4K new. Does the whole prosthetic limb get sneered at? I quite like the concept, but might be inclined to fiddle.

I really should have had a 5 gun cabinet installed… not 3.

 

[Will Hewland]

Sooo, I like the Browning 725 pro sport… I see preloved ones in decent condition for 2300 and less.

or the beretta 694 b fast, which is quite a piece more. Well double as there aren’t any used ones for sale

found the above with TSK for £4K new. Does the whole prosthetic limb get sneered at? I quite like the concept, but might be inclined to fiddle.

I really should have had a 5 gun cabinet installed… not 3.

Personally I think the 725 Pro Sport has an overly dead and heavy barrel, which will suit some but probably not a good first gun. But this is more a theory than a fact. The Beretta is a more conventional feel I would say. The terminators arm is fascinating and depends on whether you can optimise the set up or have a mental melt down trying. Again, not a beginners tool I would suggest, because frankly you won’t be holding and standing really nicely for a good while yet, so you would be setting it up to fit a wonky you, if that makes sense. A more conventional gun will force you to mount as intended (assuming it’s a decent fit, as assessed by somebody that knows). Of course the experienced person could set the TSK for you and then confiscate the tools for 6 months.

 

[Bavarian]

Don' t fordert the Beretta 690 AS. A fine gun also available with an adjustable comb and almost 1k under the 694.
Worth a look!

 

[MartynB]

A Question you should ask is , ‘ if I don’t like the gun how much money will I lose if I sell it back to you in a couple of months ? “ . Bear in mind that on a new gun about 17% of the gross price you pay has just gone to the tax man .

 

[Stiggers]

Any updates Op?

 

[RussP]

Any updates Op?

Further down the rabbit hole… used CG invictus III ASCENT is in the mix… sorry

What a pretty thing with a solid warranty.

It’s a bit different? Have seen the TSG review on the M spec case hardened one. Fixed choke.

Am I now worrying unnecessarily about steel proof barrels or lack thereof? Clays only no feathers.

 

[RussP]

If you are off to Potters:

https://gun.co.uk/shotguns/beretta-682-gold-e-12g-used-gun29138
There are many people that reckon there has never been a better clay buster made than the 682 Gold E. Already got the adjustable fitted. If it's in good working order it'll be a cracking starter gun. Potters will let you take it for a try before you buy as well - if you go in the week West Kent is just down the road or Willow Farm isn't too far on a Saturday.

yes, having instruction from Tom Friar at WKSS. thanks

 

[MartynB]

You are worrying unnecessarily about Steel Proof Barrels . For either clay or game shooting , cartridges are available in standard steel that can be shot through normal nitro proofed barrels . It’s highly unlikely you will ever need to shoot High Performance steel shells unless you decide to go wild-fowling or ultra high pheasant shooting . If steel shot becomes mandatory you may need to open fixed chokes up depending how tight they are to start with , but that’s cheap around £70 a barrel . . Ask Potter’s what a Briley multi choke conversion would cost .

 

[Bavarian]

The gun proof office in Ulm, Germany, has published a report where steel shot up to 3.25 mm (shot Size 4 or 5) 12/70 with standard gas pressure can be used in
non "steel proof" guns. Larger shot sizes in combination with tight chokes may cause a barrel damage as steel shot will not deform as well as lead does.
It is also not recommended to use tight chokes in "steel proof" guns because of that. But shooting 12/76 Magnum size 3 steel shot is also not very common...
So any steel clay cartridge will work in a 12/70 gun. But I won´t spend too much on a non- steel proof gun.

 

[Paul120]

The gun proof office in Ulm, Germany, has published a report where steel shot up to 3.25 mm (shot Size 4 or 5) 12/70 with standard gas pressure can be used in
non "steel proof" guns. Larger shot sizes in combination with tight chokes may cause a barrel damage as steel shot will not deform as well as lead does.
It is also not recommended to use tight chokes in "steel proof" guns because of that. But shooting 12/76 Magnum size 3 steel shot is also not very common...
So any steel clay cartridge will work in a 12/70 gun. But I won´t spend too much on a non- steel proof gun.

This was also my understanding of the CIP regulations. Standards steel can be used in any modern shotgun using all choke constrictions. However as steel throws a tighter pattern half choke for steel is effectively throws a full choke pattern so there's no point in having more choke.
One of the proof houses could really help by posting a video on YouTube and on forums on what the rules stipulate and what is practical.

 

[RussP]

Quick update … still waiting for my ticket. Been 6 weeks since the FEO grant… anyways thanks for the input.

 

[Mad dog]

Why on earth would you want to spend £7,000 on a gun, better off to spend around £2,500 on a good used gun that fits you & spend more money on shooting It.

 

[RussP]

I‘m In the fortunate position of being able to do both. Still waiting. I will be buying used.

 

[RussP]

Yes! Ticket arrived Friday. I can tell you I am quite excited. I am in the market for two guns, 1 for number one son to use he’s four inches taller @6 4. And something for me. For him a budget of 2k, and I’m thinking something like a 682 Gold E adjustable, I like those despite the chequering being disliked? as long as it fits he’ll need a longer stock I presume, and for me a DT10 or sh DT11, I read some folks went back to their 10s, a sh blaser f3 vantage, or an early k80. Budget 6k.

I should be haggling at the gun shop I presume in the current cljmate? 10% or whatever.

I’ve been looking now for 5 months and I have become picky on the ‘furniture’. Addictive.

Cheers!

 

[Freddypip]

I good 682 Gold E is a superb starting gun but many have been shot hard so don't rule out a 686 E Evo or similar. A lot of Gold E's were so liked that they were used to the point of being worn out so be careful.

The three guns you mention for yourself are all top end and designed for experienced shots who know why they are buying X or Y etc. The K80 is quite heavy for example and you must expect and know how to use that weight. It's been said above that you may be better to buy a starter and work up and I agree with this - many will shoot a 694 when they can afford a DT11 but the latter is 'too much gun'. Its not about the money and I can easily see you swaping a DT11 for a K80 for a F3 and taking a hit each time whilst you work out what you want - or more accurately work out what you don't want.

 

[Luke_(NL)]

I concur with Freddypip. Having gone through a similar process without strict budgetary restraints, it was tempting to immediately go for something top-end. But, looking back I'm glad I didn't. As you start, it's about 65 % ability and experience gained, 34 % is gun fit and probably less than a percent is down to the actual material.

I bought a second hand 692 black edition (the 694 of its day) happily learned how to break clays with that, prior to buying a "terminator arm" (Ergosign Evocomp) and finetuning my set-up. Another year or two in, I bought a DT11 black edition (as i got a very sensible offer) and am still transitioning to using that. Now that I have come across an Ergosign stock for the DT11, the 692 will become a back-up gun.

I may have had less outlay if I had straight up bought a DT11, but in all likelihood I would then still have wanted to buy something else along the way. Having shot for a couple of years with the 'lesser' and more run-of-the mill 692, I can now distinguish the the particular characteristics of a DT11 and know why I prefer those over say a those of a Perazzi, a Blaser and my 'old' gun. I am also very confident that it suits me and my style of shooting, as a result of shooting often and trying any gun I could get my hands around.

I do recommend an adjustable stock for your first gun, as you may want to make some changes as you learn how to mount, develop your stance and keep your eye over the rib. Buy a b-fast (or similar) stock initially and make (only) the changes to length and comb for optimal contact and get experienced help in doing so. The Ergosign, TSK, CAS and others have many more options to finesse (basically anything can be adjusted) but until you know why you would want to change things I'd suggest you don't. Personally I get on really well with the Ergosign, but they're not for everyone. And I do get a lot of comments on prosthetic limbs, but I take them in stride.

TLDR: I'd advise buying a s/h 'mid-range' gun with an adjustable comb and start shooting lots. Then figure out what you like and don't like and decide on what your boxes are and what top-end gun ticks those. Buy the same (first) gun for your son: He'll feel like your equal and neither of you will be able to say the win is due to "better material" . Most of all enjoy learning the sport, especially with your kid(s).