What type of shoot is good for ther future of Sporting?

[optima]

CLYNT SAYS ,WHAT TYPE OF SHOOT IS GOOD FOR THE FUTURE OF THE SPORT LONG TERM??

For me personally it,s got to be variation of targets, bit of everything, Driven, Close crossers,long crossers, Duck (from behind) Teal, quartering fast and slow,loupers rabbits etc, even different coloured clays make it more interesting, nothing worse than a hundred black standard clay,s imo.

No ground owner is going to keep everyone happy as they,re trying to cater for shooters ranging from beginers to top internationals all shooting at the same targets,so there has to be a balance, some easy, some hard.

The top shooters don,t want to be shooting straight at everything but on the other hand if you want new people,youngsters etc to come into a very expensive sport they don,t want to be demoralised everyweek they need to enjoy it, and this means by breaking targets, so how many soft compared to how many hard targets,???? who knows, this is where everyone has a differing opinion,for me personally get more of a thrill out of sooting a real long target than an on the end of the barrel job but at the same time i wouldn,t want to shoot a hundred of them week in week out.

For me,Nigel hart (st dials) steve lovatt (westonwood,westfield) and ian stones(wylie) usually strike a good balance,always plenty of variety to suit all abilities.

 

[Clynt]

CLYNT SAYS ,WHAT TYPE OF SHOOT IS GOOD FOR THE FUTURE OF THE SPORT LONG TERM??

For me personally it,s got to be variation of targets, bit of everything, Driven, Close crossers,long crossers, Duck (from behind) Teal, quartering fast and slow,loupers rabbits etc, even different coloured clays make it more interesting, nothing worse than a hundred black standard clay,s imo.

No ground owner is going to keep everyone happy as they,re trying to cater for shooters ranging from beginers to top internationals all shooting at the same targets,so there has to be a balance, some easy, some hard.

The top shooters don,t want to be shooting straight at everything but on the other hand if you want new people,youngsters etc to come into a very expensive sport they don,t want to be demoralised everyweek they need to enjoy it, and this means by breaking targets, so how many soft compared to how many hard targets,???? who knows, this is where everyone has a differing opinion,for me personally get more of a thrill out of sooting a real long target than an on the end of the barrel job but at the same time i wouldn,t want to shoot a hundred of them week in week out.

For me,Nigel hart (st dials) steve lovatt (westonwood,westfield) and ian stones(wylie) usually strike a good balance,always plenty of variety to suit all abilities.

I'll second that and I would have to add Newbold to the list, but you must admit it's becoming all about scores and not target quality which is effecting entry no's ....at many shoots to win B class you will require to hit AAA or AA average ?? so are the averages wrong !!

 

[ExSCA]

Moved this to its own topic - I think its an interesting debate....

 

[Will Hewland]

The averages are just that. AVERAGES. Some shooters are very inconsistent. I know one A class guy, who is nearly AA who in his own words ' hits 65 or 90'. He really has good and bad days. This makes the winning score seem out of kilter.

Frustratingly, I probably hold the record for most consistent. I only drop a score about every 25 shoots, so I am a very good example of my average. When somebody wins C on 83, I often look at their scores and find that hey have never hit more than 75 before and it amazes me. Some folk just vary I guess..

 

[Clynt]

each ground is responsible for producing what they feel people want,those who want easy have plenty to choose from.big scores normally produce big entries which is good for making a profit, which in turn makes their business viable, as shooters can we effect what we shoot at ? personally I have seen many shooters avoid grounds which they feel are to hard, and opt for easier ones so in respect I suppose we can.

The earlier point regarding variation must be the common denominator, hard or easy should not really come into this, with out the word "good"put in front of both, there the dilemma unfolds, unlike the concrete disciplines we have no set angles or distances to follow, so is there a reason for ever increasing "shoot straight at" targets at so many grounds ? what are we teaching shooters to do, could this be a reason why many fall at the major's with a couple of tough stands. :huh:

 

[GavB]

having just shot FITASC at Weston Wood, I would vote for Steves targets I think he covered every type of target imaginable

 

[jasper]

keggy today was a fine example of a sporting shoot. and had the entries to prove it . super. also i like newbold.

Clynt. the averages are open to abuse , espcially when baggers keep their cards in pockets....... keggy was quite tough today but C was being won off 83. and this being the first weekend of the new issue , it makes you wonder. when richard bunning could "only" manage 90 . what goes on..?

 

[Clynt]

keggy today was a fine example of a sporting shoot. and had the entries to prove it . super. also i like newbold.

Clynt. the averages are open to abuse , espcially when baggers keep their cards in pockets....... keggy was quite tough today but C was being won off 83. and this being the first weekend of the new issue , it makes you wonder. when richard bunning could "only" manage 90 . what goes on..?

may be it was not tough enough then ???? something as got to be looked at by both grounds and the governing body people in lower classes seem to unleash scores way out side their limits ..how ? lucky ? good day ?

I have been to 2 shoots this weekend where 95's in AA have been out or at the back end of the prize money !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! this surely is walking the path of why should I go in the competition......and when this becomes prevalent there will be so many shooters in B/O. WHAT HAPPENS THEN ????? once you give or provide easy, soft targets to B and C class shooters you can never really take them away, the whole format needs re-jigging bagging needs addressing NOW... then may be lower classes will be prepared to be happy with tough targets and staying within their class untill their efforts and perseverance take them to their true ability, instead of shooting false scores at soft shoots ....

 

[Chipper]

CLYNT SAYS ,WHAT TYPE OF SHOOT IS GOOD FOR THE FUTURE OF THE SPORT LONG TERM??

For me personally it,s got to be variation of targets, bit of everything, Driven, Close crossers,long crossers, Duck (from behind) Teal, quartering fast and slow,loupers rabbits etc, even different coloured clays make it more interesting, nothing worse than a hundred black standard clay,s imo.

No ground owner is going to keep everyone happy as they,re trying to cater for shooters ranging from beginers to top internationals all shooting at the same targets,so there has to be a balance, some easy, some hard.

The top shooters don,t want to be shooting straight at everything but on the other hand if you want new people,youngsters etc to come into a very expensive sport they don,t want to be demoralised everyweek they need to enjoy it, and this means by breaking targets, so how many soft compared to how many hard targets,???? who knows, this is where everyone has a differing opinion,for me personally get more of a thrill out of sooting a real long target than an on the end of the barrel job but at the same time i wouldn,t want to shoot a hundred of them week in week out.

For me,Nigel hart (st dials) steve lovatt (westonwood,westfield) and ian stones(wylie) usually strike a good balance,always plenty of variety to suit all abilities.

well Clynt just had a read of your article and got to say that is bang on the nail, sporting if were not careful will be renamed sportskeet £37 and carts it has got to start being good value for money and enjoyable but not cricket scores to come nowhere other than lower class shooters ending up in the wrong class then everyone going birds only !!!!!

 

[Chipper]

may be it was not tough enough then ???? something as got to be looked at by both grounds and the governing body people in lower classes seem to unleash scores way out side their limits ..how ? lucky ? good day ?

I have been to 2 shoots this weekend where 95's in AA have been out or at the back end of the prize money !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! this surely is walking the path of why should I go in the competition......and when this becomes prevalent there will be so many shooters in B/O. WHAT HAPPENS THEN ????? once you give or provide easy, soft targets to B and C class shooters you can never really take them away, the whole format needs re-jigging bagging needs addressing NOW... then may be lower classes will be prepared to be happy with tough targets and staying within their class untill their efforts and perseverance take them to their true ability, instead of shooting false scores at soft shoots ....

Bagging, i remember some chap in the Glos area quoting about bagging and has now fallen from 'A' class to 'B' class after accusing Folk of 'Baggin' tut tut.... throw stones by all means but dont live in greenhouses

 

[Fuzrat]

I take it you rated Longridge as an easy shoot today Clynt? If so, I have to say I agree, enjoyable as it was. I didnt shoot anywhere near as good as I did last weekend at the EO or 4C's yesterday and still managed to be above my average. Had I of shot to anywhere near the form of the last couple of shoots I feel I could have grabbed an 80 odd.

This is why the classification periods need to be shorter than 6 monthly, and using scores a year old is just ridiculous. I have scores from when I started back on the registered circuit still holding my average down. I'm slowly raising my raw average so they will be dropped but it aint happening fast enough for my liking or hopefully a few months down the line my fellow competitors liking.

 

[optima]

well Clynt just had a read of your article and got to say that is bang on the nail, sporting if were not careful will be renamed sportskeet £37 and carts it has got to start being good value for money and enjoyable but not cricket scores to come nowhere other than lower class shooters ending up in the wrong class then everyone going birds only !!!!!

Well thats whats happening, i went birds only yesterday (78 fauxdegla) and today (84 kegworth) whats the point of chucking an extra 5-6 quid away at each shoot, i,ve shot a few easy shoots over last few months not intensionaly as you don,t know till you get there what it,s gonna be like, and i,ve gone into AA so in the same class as martin myers etc but certainly not in the same league, in my opinion i,m A class yet never picked up much money there either and went comp everytime, i obviously enjoy my shooting so winnings don,t come into it, perhaps might go comp when i feel my shooting has got a bit better till then i,ll put them £5-£6 s towards cartridges

 

[snipey]

I think that's being slightly cynical; this is coming from a C class shot who won his class at the English Open with an 81ex100 when it was won with a 95. You can't simply judge a 'sandbagger' by the score. In my mind a 'sandbagger' is judged by the scores they have entered and whether they have dropped scores over the last issue. If they are regularly/frequently putting in 80+ scores at various grounds then it's probably a fair assumption. However an occasional great score doesn't automatically equal 'sandbagger', for me it's the result of coaching once a month/shooting 400+ registered targets every month and the luck of everything coming together at one point in time.

 

[Darkside]

Spot on Snipey!!!

 

[Fuzrat]

I personally dont think hardly anyone Bags C class. Its such a transitional class and as snipey has said you get new and improving shooters in there that are working hard to get up the classes, shooting loads and taking instruction. Give us a break and actually let us get up the ranks quicker, where we want to be!

 

[Clynt]

I take it you rated Longridge as an easy shoot today Clynt? If so, I have to say I agree, enjoyable as it was. I didnt shoot anywhere near as good as I did last weekend at the EO or 4C's yesterday and still managed to be above my average. Had I of shot to anywhere near the form of the last couple of shoots I feel I could have grabbed an 80 odd.

This is why the classification periods need to be shorter than 6 monthly, and using scores a year old is just ridiculous. I have scores from when I started back on the registered circuit still holding my average down. I'm slowly raising my raw average so they will be dropped but it aint happening fast enough for my liking or hopefully a few months down the line my fellow competitors liking.

good point there Fuz but dont you feel stronger layouts levels the field of play ? personally would like to see a system of coming down a class be over 12 months

 

[Fuzrat]

Not got a problem with stiff layouts, thats why I try and shoot as many different grounds as possible. Whats the point in shooting 1or2 grounds and getting a classification from that.

Its finding a balance, no point in making it so stiff that HG is low 80s that means us mere mortals are gonna be staring down the barrel of a 40 odd, surefire way to turn people off. On the other hand if I wanted to see shoots won with 98/9s I would start shooting skeet.

Its very tough to find that balance, ground owners want feet on the ground and honestly dont care who goes comp or birds, no skin off their nose if they dont have to worry about what money is going where. Shooters want to break clays. I for one want to be challenged whilst doing that but not beaten into getting the golf clubs out the garage :.:

Quite right on coming down, has to be harder and over a longer period to drop down a class than to go up.

 

[snipey]

I personally agree with a longer period to come down a class; however I know several people that shot 300 targets at a single ground shooting a 80/70/60 ish scores going straight into AA when strictly a C/B class? Not sure how to handle these people fairly?

(null)

 

[Emmsy]

the classes should be done on countback from the HG score, it wouldnt matter then if the shoot was won on a 97 or 85.