Revoked shotgun / firearms tickets.

[philpot]

This is a subject that has been covered I am sure but I wanted to just run through something that has just happened to my shooting friend.  A few days ago I got a call from my friend saying he has just had a visit from the police, he thought to deliver his renewal shotgun / firearms certificates, instead they presented him with a letter and said they were taking all his guns and ammo/cartridges. He was told that his tickets were revoked and as such he cannot have any of the items, they were being taken as he has no license.

A reason was given but forgive me if I do not go into the reasons as there may be further talks, although his insurance provider has not impressed him (or me) by their very quick response in saying there was nothing they can do.............

For my early thoughts on the explanation given to me, it seems very strange to revoke a license to a man who has had shotguns most of his life with no issues at all. I am not saying the police are out of order as I have not seen the letters or have the minute details but it does worry me that this is gaining momentum across the country. I do feel that cock ups in renewal applications must be a thing of the past for any certificate holder so as to not give reason to revoke our tickets of which I believe there are a great many cases running into the hundreds.

I also believe there is huge negative feeling following the sad deaths of the family in Devon area which may be putting the police under pressure to reduce guns in the community and this would be one way to do that.  I am tempted to be talking to the firearms officer when my tickets are due next to ensure I do everything correctly so as to keep my tickets safe despite owning guns for 55 years and never being refused a ticket, it scares the hell out of me.

Phil

 

[ColinD]

Unfortunately unless you or others know the exact reason for the Polices actions I'm afraid anything said here will just be guess work

Is he a member of any shooting organization with a legal side, because you say his insurance provider, but as he has found it's not in their remit when it comes to grants/renewals. They just cover the guns/shooting kit for theft/accidental damage like any other

 

[FESkent]

They are taking zero risk following plymouth, it may not be anything your friend has actually done, it may be other family members or friends he or they are associated with.

However as has been said without knowing all the facts little anybody can do or say to help. 

Can they take shotgun cartridges? As you do not need a licence to possess them and he still could shoot at a clay ground with a section 11(6) exemption by borrowing a shotgun whilst on the ground.

CPSA full membership insurance offers cover for certificate being revoked, unlike BASC.

HO guide

Shot gun cartridges
2.57 A shot gun certificate is not required to possess or acquire shot gun cartridges containing five or more shot, none of which exceeds .36 inch in diameter. All ordinary shot cartridges are covered by this description. However, a shot gun certificate (or firearm certificate authorising possession of a section 1 shot gun) is normally required to purchase shot gun cartridges. All single bulleted ammunition, for example solid slug, spherical ball or projectiles for birdscaring equipment, is subject to the requirement for a firearm certificate.

 

[MartynB]

The police have to respond to any ‘ intelligence ‘ with the public safety as a priority .

About 3 years ago , a friend of mine ( now sadly departed ) , had taken one of his young workers to task for slacking  - a  ‘ gypsie’s warning ‘ if you will .   The disgruntled worker , with no evidence  or witness but a bad bout of malice , raised a false complaint to the company HR department , that he had been assaulted , and also phoned the police . When my buddy got home the following evening , the police were waiting and his guns and rifles were removed .  It transpired later that the Complainant was known to police  and subsequently was arrested and convicted of several offences ( his conduct was  unknown to the employers )  , and ended up in jail . 
A blind man could have seen the complaint was spurious , but the short version is my friend spent nearly £1500 on legal fees .  A solicitor wrote to the police , no joy despite them having them having the complainant in their records , they could not ignore the accusation , A hearing was arranged by my friends solicitors to appeal the revocation in front of a judge . The police did not attend ,  the judge supported my friend’s appeal and he got his guns back .  I suppose the moral is the police can’t take lightly an accusation that questions the suitability of someone to own a firearm . 

 

[philpot]

Unfortunately unless you or others know the exact reason for the Polices actions I'm afraid anything said here will just be guess work

Is he a member of any shooting organization with a legal side, because you say his insurance provider, but as he has found it's not in their remit when it comes to grants/renewals. They just cover the guns/shooting kit for theft/accidental damage like any other

£20k of so called legal cover but it doesn't seem to be there when needed.   I am not looking for advice in this matter Colin only to bring a thought provoking subject to everyone.Sorry it may have come across in the wrong way.

 

[Jan Powell]

This is a subject that has been covered I am sure but I wanted to just run through something that has just happened to my shooting friend.  A few days ago I got a call from my friend saying he has just had a visit from the police, he thought to deliver his renewal shotgun / firearms certificates, instead they presented him with a letter and said they were taking all his guns and ammo/cartridges. He was told that his tickets were revoked and as such he cannot have any of the items, they were being taken as he has no license.

A reason was given but forgive me if I do not go into the reasons as there may be further talks, although his insurance provider has not impressed him (or me) by their very quick response in saying there was nothing they can do.............

For my early thoughts on the explanation given to me, it seems very strange to revoke a license to a man who has had shotguns most of his life with no issues at all. I am not saying the police are out of order as I have not seen the letters or have the minute details but it does worry me that this is gaining momentum across the country. I do feel that cock ups in renewal applications must be a thing of the past for any certificate holder so as to not give reason to revoke our tickets of which I believe there are a great many cases running into the hundreds.

I also believe there is huge negative feeling following the sad deaths of the family in Devon area which may be putting the police under pressure to reduce guns in the community and this would be one way to do that.  I am tempted to be talking to the firearms officer when my tickets are due next to ensure I do everything correctly so as to keep my tickets safe despite owning guns for 55 years and never being refused a ticket, it scares the hell out of me.

Phil

Without knowledge of the case it’s impossible to comment on why the police took the action they have. All I would say is they won’t seize/revoke without good reason.

I’d suggest your friend speaks to a solicitor specialising in firearms law.

 

[Les53]

Without knowledge of the case it’s impossible to comment on why the police took the action they have. All I would say is they won’t seize/revoke without good reason.

I’d suggest your friend speaks to a solicitor specialising in firearms law.

I agree Jan, the guy needs to get some proper legal advice without a doubt. 
They must think they have some valid reason to take his ticket and his guns. 
The police are now going to be super cautious about everything related to gun ownership. 

 

[ColinD]

£20k of so called legal cover but it doesn't seem to be there when needed.   I am not looking for advice in this matter Colin only to bring a thought provoking subject to everyone.Sorry it may have come across in the wrong way.

Looks like £20k of legal cover if he gets the legal advice needed, he needs to clarify that with the insurance provider. Again it's not up to them to provide the legal advice just pay for it 

 

[JJ47]

This thread is ridiculous, are you genuine shooters? A simple understanding of the difference between what is 'Lawful' and what is 'Legal', what is 'Common Law' and what is Admiralty or Maritime Law clearly needs to be studied by everyone in the shooting community, because whilst you're all watching the scripted psyop playing out on the idiot box, big changes have been made in recent years and are ongoing. We've all been told, albeit in a way where the plain truth was hidden in plain sight (think the recent 'news' story of barristers going on strike). 

Also, please stop spreading or furthering discussions about 'false flag' operations that were so obviously orchestrated to revive the pre text narratives for gun removal. Its exactly what they do in the US. Hungerford and Plymouth were both False Flag ops.

The same thing applies to the ridiculous lead shot discussion, its a complete nonsense. If they cared for the environment then one could ask why they've been spraying toxic heavy metals into the atmosphere over our crops for years (and have only recently stopped after military justice intervention).

It's just as nonsensical as that annoying recorded message in the supermarket advising shoppers to wear an ineffective mask. The recording states that they have shoppers health interests at heart , but if that was true they wouldn't be selling 85% of the processed muck they put on their shelves.

RESEARCH, DISCERN & THINK. Do not just accept the narrative being put out. There's always a reason and agenda at play.

If you don't want to be tricked into 'consenting' to being wronged or done over, or your property being stolen from you by 'Policy Enforcement' then arm yourself with the right knowledge.

We are currently living in a transitional period where ignorance can easily lead to victimhood.

£20k in 'legal' cover or solicitors are not needed. One just needs to be bothered to do some research and read some books. We all do that when buying another gun, or car.

 

[Les53]

Yes we are all interested in how we protect ourselves from further legislation and welcome your help and input. 

 

[JJ47]

Yes we are all interested in how we protect ourselves from further legislation and welcome your help and input. 

Ok Les,

Please forgive me if this response, or indeed any of my posts, come across as curt or rude it is not my intention, I’m a facts not feelings type, I’m very busy and will not waste my time with BS or anyone who dismisses my well researched input without researching any of it themselves – that is the height of ignorance.

So, here’s my input, I hope it helps.

First of all, everyone in Britain needs to turn off and stop watching the idiot box because it is the biggest waste of time and is only for the truly brain dead.

Secondly, everyone in Britain needs to start taking responsibility for their own reality and affairs, and this means stop relying on and trusting the Government (which is not only illegitimate, but we have been shown that it is criminal) and to make the effort to Do Your Own Research (DYOR) on these important matters that affect our lives and freedoms. It is not up to me to study this information for everyone – everyone needs to research it for themselves.

Thirdly, and back to the topic at hand, which is something that about 90% do not realise, is that we are all living under common law jurisdiction of magna carta, which covers us for all matters of law and also gives us equal balance under law – this is key. It does not matter if you live in the USA, Canada, New Zealand, GB, or any other Country. The law is the law and rules and ‘Acts’ of legal frameworks are made up. Do not consent to or play in ‘their Act’ or be fooled by their sophisticated sounding language – they are just ‘babbling’.  In fact, a good understanding of etymology will also help.

Now this doesn’t mean that gun possession cannot be regulated, but what it does mean is that we are protected. So when an ignorant over reaching Government Employee comes knocking on your door demanding to take your guns (your property) away from you then you have a Lawful basis in which to prevent this kind of over reach, and robustly defend your position.

It doesn’t matter what the scenario or situation is, for most of us who are regular law-abiding folk who like to do our sporting and game shooting then we can use the constitution to protect us. Here’s some links to useful resources to research, and it doesn’t matter that they are USA resources either. I strongly recommend you watch the entire series of David Straight, because it will give you a broader situational awareness of what’s been going on in the world for the last few years, links below.

https://www.justia.com/constitutional-law/gun-rights-under-the-constitution/

The traditional definition of "due process" is that the government cannot take away life, liberty, or property from any person without a legal proceeding.

https://www.justia.com/constitutional-law/due-process-under-the-constitution/

The David Straight Out of Babylon series is a recording of his re-training of law professionals, and provides excellent basis for understanding this. Here’s a link to Part 1 – best to start from the 3 min point.

Out of Babylon with David Straight - Part 1 (rumble.com)

 

[Les53]

Ok Les,

Please forgive me if this response, or indeed any of my posts, come across as curt or rude it is not my intention, I’m a facts not feelings type, I’m very busy and will not waste my time with BS or anyone who dismisses my well researched input without researching any of it themselves – that is the height of ignorance.

So, here’s my input, I hope it helps.

First of all, everyone in Britain needs to turn off and stop watching the idiot box because it is the biggest waste of time and is only for the truly brain dead.

Secondly, everyone in Britain needs to start taking responsibility for their own reality and affairs, and this means stop relying on and trusting the Government (which is not only illegitimate, but we have been shown that it is criminal) and to make the effort to Do Your Own Research (DYOR) on these important matters that affect our lives and freedoms. It is not up to me to study this information for everyone – everyone needs to research it for themselves.

Thirdly, and back to the topic at hand, which is something that about 90% do not realise, is that we are all living under common law jurisdiction of magna carta, which covers us for all matters of law and also gives us equal balance under law – this is key. It does not matter if you live in the USA, Canada, New Zealand, GB, or any other Country. The law is the law and rules and ‘Acts’ of legal frameworks are made up. Do not consent to or play in ‘their Act’ or be fooled by their sophisticated sounding language – they are just ‘babbling’.  In fact, a good understanding of etymology will also help.

Now this doesn’t mean that gun possession cannot be regulated, but what it does mean is that we are protected. So when an ignorant over reaching Government Employee comes knocking on your door demanding to take your guns (your property) away from you then you have a Lawful basis in which to prevent this kind of over reach, and robustly defend your position.

It doesn’t matter what the scenario or situation is, for most of us who are regular law-abiding folk who like to do our sporting and game shooting then we can use the constitution to protect us. Here’s some links to useful resources to research, and it doesn’t matter that they are USA resources either. I strongly recommend you watch the entire series of David Straight, because it will give you a broader situational awareness of what’s been going on in the world for the last few years, links below.

https://www.justia.com/constitutional-law/gun-rights-under-the-constitution/

The traditional definition of "due process" is that the government cannot take away life, liberty, or property from any person without a legal proceeding.

https://www.justia.com/constitutional-law/due-process-under-the-constitution/

The David Straight Out of Babylon series is a recording of his re-training of law professionals, and provides excellent basis for understanding this. Here’s a link to Part 1 – best to start from the 3 min point.

Out of Babylon with David Straight - Part 1 (rumble.com)

Thank you for your input, I’m sure it will be well received.