Masic
Well-known member
ahhh going to be put straight into b class 
.. onwards and upwards to my goal to get into and stay in a class
.. onwards and upwards to my goal to get into and stay in a class 
Classification System
- Thread starter maddmatt
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RobertBeard
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In small-bore target shooting the classification system is also disappointing as you are awarded a national classification depending on your performance outdoors on Century Range at Bisley which is a wicked range with wind and mirage. Your indoor average is used if you have no national classification so when I first went there donkeys years ago I started in C class and performed so dismally on the national outdoor range that I promptly went down to D class until after a couple of years I won my way out into C again. Then after a couple of years won my way into B class by shooting the Scottish again renowned for wicked conditions and then went to Bisley and got promoted to A class in the same year in fact within 6 weeks. The top class in the target game is X class and there are now only 100 shooters in it. The top 10% of A get promoted and the bottom 10% of X get demoted. There was a time when X class which is supposed to be only the elite was full of shooters who were no longer capable of being in the class as their shooting had declined so the compulsory demotion was introduced. Its a big dent in the ego to be demoted but if one has been ill, been out of the game for a while after an operation it seems only fair to let them shoot in their true class whilst they try and recover their form. Mind you there is no longer any money in target shooting so its honours based. Everyone would almost kill to get into X class and the related bragging rights. "I have been in X class for XX years etc."
Not terribly relevant but of interest and in provincial comps people find excuses to nominate a lower class and sandbag or cheat. Me I've been in A class nationally and will always shoot in A class at local/county comps but nationally I have been demoted to B. Sob, Sob etc Age is taking its toll!!
Not terribly relevant but of interest and in provincial comps people find excuses to nominate a lower class and sandbag or cheat. Me I've been in A class nationally and will always shoot in A class at local/county comps but nationally I have been demoted to B. Sob, Sob etc Age is taking its toll!!
Macc Ladd
Well-known member
Well there's even less money to win down the golf club. But your free to express your opinion. Maybe coming from west Wales where we don't shoot so many reg targets, "sandbagging is not something we come across very often" I don't shoot clays to win money I shoot because I enjoy it, prize money is only a bonus.
Sandbagger !!! No only joking Ray , I know how much you wanted to get into AA . Only speaking about skeet ,you get some shooters who seem to shoot not a lot of registered targets and stay in AA and others who shoot literally thousands of registered targets also AA ,so who really is a true AA shot ?? .Also there are as has been stated, quite a few shooters who suspiously seem to be in classes lower than their ability (dont say a word Ray ,i know ) .In Skeet you have shooters that will stay in a class they should'nt be in to stay at the top of the tree therefore always in or near the money /Trophies ,where'as in a higher class they're generally never going to win!
So it would seem to be you have two sorts of shooters (plus others who just accept they are where they are in class) you have the shooter that wants to be at the top of the class tree, and the shooter that wants to be a big fish in a small pool and pick up money !!
Clynt
Well-known member
Finding a fitting answer to the class averages other than the one we have (bad as it may seem) is unlikely. I have heard most scenarios some have valid points others have discriminating actions, the sad situation has come about by people legally abusing the system. Shooters form can change for many reasons, new gun, new shells, had a few lessons, regular practise on chosen grounds and many more valid reasons.
,Sporting is not like any of the concrete disciplines,and it's allure to most is it's variation, this is why, in my view so popular and for these reasons so hard balance the classes.The sporting shoots over the past 10 years have far to much in common, by this I mean you tend to see virtually the same targets where-ever you go, and grounds that produce easy shoots will get shooters posting big scores and more often big entries,
So is it really surprising to see bigger and bigger scores winning all the classes ?
would it not make sense to increase the targets needed to be classed down and lessen the amount needed to rise up ? this may then leave shoot owners more scope to move the parameters of course setting, with out the fear of losing customers.
,Sporting is not like any of the concrete disciplines,and it's allure to most is it's variation, this is why, in my view so popular and for these reasons so hard balance the classes.The sporting shoots over the past 10 years have far to much in common, by this I mean you tend to see virtually the same targets where-ever you go, and grounds that produce easy shoots will get shooters posting big scores and more often big entries,
So is it really surprising to see bigger and bigger scores winning all the classes ?
would it not make sense to increase the targets needed to be classed down and lessen the amount needed to rise up ? this may then leave shoot owners more scope to move the parameters of course setting, with out the fear of losing customers.
Andre, I know someone who shot a 100 straight in Doubles recently and is in A Class for Doubles... :crazy: :spiteful:
That's what I thought too!!! Then things come together (sometimes) practice my weaknesses (whenever I can) had a few lessons, taken advice (only from the very few people I trust) try to learn from my (many) mistakes...and a 1st, two 2nd's and two 3'rd's in B later and my average is sending me to A where I know I'll have to work even harder to compete...but that's why I do it!!!
Knew I was passing a clay ground to pick up some spare parts at lunch time, took the gun, 100 shells and a skeet vest, had 75 of two specific birds I didn't shoot as well as I should have on Sunday, 20 on a high crosser from a tower, realised after the first one I'd need missing them over the top!!! Stopped after I'd shot 10 of them straight. Then a slow crosser that needed almost no lead, just at the front edge...took my thick head longer to work out my gun speed was killing me, slowed it down and started smashing them, then shot 5 pairs on report following a fast crosser in the opposite direction, then 5 pairs simo...ah ha, that confused my brain...going from a fast gun speed in one direction that needed 3ft lead to a slow gun speed in the other that needed no lead!!! Shot 3 pairs, 3 pairs, 3pairs, straight on the 3rd set. That will do!!! "Oh, I have 26 shells left..." I thought, round of skeet...25/25 on solo delay...happy with that!!!
Ordinarily I would agree but I have won D class in ABT with a D class score (75ex100). There were slightly higher scores on the day but they were 'birds only'. £40 winnings just covered the entry fee but very welcome all the same.
Only happened once though. :-(
DT
EDIT: Just checked the scores and no, there were no higher BO scores so I was the highest D class score out of 8
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The two other scenario's you have when it comes to competition (which has been seen many times ) is you have certain shooters that can hit big scores all day long but as soon as it comes to big comps./ selection shoots the nerves take over and they shoot one or two classes below they're normal scores .Also seen at Majors are shooters that shoot scores (even their first tons ) they've never shot before , leaving many people saying "where did that come from" and you know it's nothing to do with "sandbagging" .........................Thats why its called "shooting" not "hitting".
I said I would expand and here it is, reading the first few pages it seems to me that everyone is coming at this from different angles and their chosen disciplines ie trap guy says plan A will work very well and is rubbished by the sporters and skeeters. Skeeter says plan B will do the job and is rubbished by the trappies and sporters etc. you get the drift of how that goes. Now, speaking as a skeeter that has been picking through the skeet scores lately and not being able to totally eradicate the hedge monkey dna from my system I can empathise with 2 sides of the discipline triangle.
I totally stand by my first comment on this thread that it seems to be more of a sporting issue than a fixed target discipline apart from the always transitional lower classes.
Skeet has fixed targets, shoot more than 3 or 4 rounds of it and most people will have hit every bird at least once. They now know how to hit every bird but need to put them all together in one round, on a given day it clicks and you shoot a cricket score. From what I can gather its the same for Trap, learn the birds and sequences then its just put them all together, one day it just clicks. Spanner goes in the works with Sporting, its far too random in terms of difficulty for a standardised handicap system
We are all trying to break as many little clay discs of varying sizes as possible but the more I think on this the more I realise the differences in disciplines are not conducive to a one size fits all classification system. There is far too much randomness in sporting across different grounds, trap is slightly less random but still has the unpredictability of knowing its going away but is it left, right or up the middle. Skeet is the only one where you know exactly where they are coming from and going to.
Heres a radical idea, Why not have discipline specific handicap systems rather than the one size fits all we have at the moment that clearly people aren't satisfied with?
I totally stand by my first comment on this thread that it seems to be more of a sporting issue than a fixed target discipline apart from the always transitional lower classes.
Skeet has fixed targets, shoot more than 3 or 4 rounds of it and most people will have hit every bird at least once. They now know how to hit every bird but need to put them all together in one round, on a given day it clicks and you shoot a cricket score. From what I can gather its the same for Trap, learn the birds and sequences then its just put them all together, one day it just clicks. Spanner goes in the works with Sporting, its far too random in terms of difficulty for a standardised handicap system
We are all trying to break as many little clay discs of varying sizes as possible but the more I think on this the more I realise the differences in disciplines are not conducive to a one size fits all classification system. There is far too much randomness in sporting across different grounds, trap is slightly less random but still has the unpredictability of knowing its going away but is it left, right or up the middle. Skeet is the only one where you know exactly where they are coming from and going to.
Heres a radical idea, Why not have discipline specific handicap systems rather than the one size fits all we have at the moment that clearly people aren't satisfied with?
ips
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point taken
maybe at club shoots this is possible but not usually at nationals IMO but i take your point on board
cheers
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EdSolomons
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Macc Ladd
Well-known member
Well I thought that's what we have got, skeet comp skeet classification. Sporting comp sporting classification
I like the idea of totally seperate systems to cater for each discipline, each one does have its own issues and to use a single base system seems counter productive. So what type of system would work for say: Sporting, Fitasc, skeet & trap (assuming the last 2 needed changing)?
P
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I am always civil......and honest.
Oh ..I give up.
You just write what you want me to reply to some one who is calling my post flawed when several others like it?
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Macc Ladd
Well-known member
Macc Ladd
Well-known member
Nicola are you a trap shooter or do you just trap shoot
