Taking a gun from the rack without permission

[Lloyd Pattison]

Last night at our local club, Dee and I were out shooting the sporting, and when finished (in the bitter cold) we retired to the clubhouse for a coffee and to get warm, and sign on for a couple of lines of DTL. As normal we put our guns the the big rack in the centre of the clubhouse along with everyone else's, shooter routinely put their guns in the rack while in the clubhouse for coffee, bacon, or just waiting for their squad in whatever discipline.

A minor commotion occurred when a lad noticed that his B525 grade 5 was missing. He checked the car, asked his mates if they were taking the mick then went white as he frantically searched for his gun. My squad was called so I headed off to shoot (Mrs P would join me on the next squad after warming up more) so what happened next I found out later.

The 525 owner was literally searching the car park when he noticed a large group of people heading for the clubhouse, one of whom was carrying his gun. He ran over and asked what was going on and why the chap was carrying his gun, the response was "it was in the rack on the DTL layout, I just picked it up". The owner hadn't been on the DTL and was understandably miffed as to how it might have gotten there, but no further information was forthcoming and the large group were all shrugs, most of whom were newbies accompanied by 2 members. The same group then wandered off, then moved to the DTL layout where I was, 2 of them shooting, with 1 member who was meant to be minding them, who was actually shooting. I noticed one chap holding a CG Tempio, and thought "wow, that's one hell of a coincidence, that looks just like Dee's but it couldn't possibly be hers, because who would do that?" 

We shot the line, and the large group looked on, while the 1 experienced shot and 2 newbies took part. Line over, everyone left, and I went to collect Mrs P from the clubhouse only to discover her similarly frantic looking for her gun, she had noticed it missing, thought I had returned it to the car and was now properly upset.

Yeah, it actually happened again, same group.

I confronted the newbie (calmly) and asked why he had been shooting my wife's gun, his response (given he couldn't deny it) was indigence, "how was I supposed to know it was your wife's gun?" I pointed to the club guns in the rack, which have CLUB GUN on the barrels, and white tape on the stocks, and was met with an indifferent look, and a mumbled "not my fault, I cant tell the difference".

I spoke to the ground manager who said he would have a word with the members who were supposed to be looking after the group, and went off to shoot with my *Very* upset wife.

I don't really have a frame of reference here as I grew up around guns, I know their value, and have always respected others property, but I simply can't get my head around the fact that he and another member of that group just grabbed a gun off the rack and took it to shoot without even noticing it wasn't a club gun. 

 

[ips]

unbelievable  :frown:

 

[Mike]

Good job that they did not take it home.

You are responsible for your gun and they should not be left unatended, I've seen people leave a gun in a rack out side then gone in the cabin for a brew why?

 

[ips]

Good job that they did not take it home.

You are responsible for your gun and they should not be left untended, I've seen people leave a gun in a rack out side then gone in the cabin for a brew why?

I have known that that happen twice, wrong gun picked up and taken home.......much panic ensued from the owners...(not me by the way) 

 

[Mike]

I have known that that happen twice, wrong gun picked up and taken home.......much panic ensued from the owners...(not me by the way) 

Yes I've seen that happen too.

Many years ago at Coniston pre the large clubhouse there used to be a rack and this fella was taking different guns out for a couple of shots, I asked him what he was doing, just trying them out was his reply. After educating him on why he should not touch other shooters guns he said sorry.

 

[ips]

Yes I've seen that happen too.

Many years ago at Coniston pre the large clubhouse there used to be a rack and this fella was taking different guns out for a couple of shots, I asked him what he was doing, just trying them out was his reply. After educating him on why he should not touch other shooters guns he said sorry.

I remember those days, mobile snack van parked up and a shed as a clubhouse.....bit different now  :smile:

 

[woody]

West Kent has lovely facilities, but no guns allowed in the club house rule.  They have a rack outside the door. Makes it difficult to be in charge of your gun at all times.  It bugs the crap out of me.  I got shouted at for taking my gun, in its slip, into the clubhouse to use the toilet. 

 

[Sian]

If I am going to have a break in a club house, I always put my gun away.  I don't want to have a panic ever.  Cheeky bar stewards though taking other people's guns particularly as the club have marked the club guns so prominently with tape.  In the end the bloke who was supposed to be in charge of them need to cop it for not taking his responsibility seriously.

 

[Hamster]

I admire your calm Lloyd, many a man or woman would have let rip with Friday night obscenities. Presumably the one so called experienced shot accompanying these bell ends was aware they were carting off other peoples possessions ! Whatever, the fact still remains that you cannot afford to take your eyes off guns, I keep an eye on mine even while queueing up at the stands. 

Everything aside, were these idiots really just assuming that expensive looking guns can just be picked up and shot, what other sport allows that ? 

 

[lydiamight]

I shoot at WKSS as well---my car is never more then a few yards from the Clubhouse. Perfectly easy to just lock the gun in the boot of the car when i go to the clubhouse for a coffee etc.

 

[westley]

I think that I would be "having a word" with the two EX Members, had it occurred at my ground  !  I have had the wrong gun taken by mistake (2 gunslips alike), which is WHY I have a largish key ring attached to the zip pull to make my slip far more noticeable.

 

[Lloyd Pattison]

I don't know the 2 guys who were supposedly looking after the group so I have left it with the ground manager. I was so dismayed at the time I didn't feel I could have a useful conversation with someone who clearly DGAF. As to the subject of putting guns in a rack, we were in the clubhouse, not 10 feet away. There is an implicit trust that in a group of shooters, we all respect one another's property, and the fact that these aren't just expensive sporting equipment, they are firearms, and that alone should give you pause. My assumption is that new shooters are immediately appraised of this fact seems ill founded, although I certainly make sure anyone I am assisting is aware of it, it would seem others do not.

Lesson learned, unfortunately.

 

[Will Hewland]

I feel bad for you Lloyd and it should not happen. However it is crazy that a ground could let this happen. I am amazed their insurance criteria permits this to be possible. At EJ Churchill, the gun rack has wires and padlocks for each gun space. You put the gun down, lock it and retain the numbered key. (The only unlocked guns are in the gun room itself, but that is staffed and door locked if not). And nobody goes onto the ground unsupervised, not even members, let alone with newbies..

 

[mattjevans]

Really shocking.  Will certainly give me pause about using rack outside clubrooms in future.

 

[Salopian]

A salutory lesson for all of us .

EJ Churchill's sounds a brilliant idea, every ground should copy it.

Obviously we should all lock our guns away in the car in future , but also remove barrels and forend to comply as best we can with the Law or not leave the car unattended , which is a very difficult situation.

I think the culprits in the above incident should be banned from the club for life .

 

[Wonko the Sane]

I have no idea what the level of theft may be where you are but there is certainly nothing holy about clay target shooters here.  Not many guns lost that I've heard of but a good many other things lying unattended and lonely looking seem to get lost.  Didn't take me more than a couple to get the message.  

Granted that there are a great many look-alike guns it is a wonder to me that there are not more instances like the ones mentioned above.

besta luck

 

[mattjevans]

EJ Churchill's sounds a brilliant idea, every ground should copy it.

Though the "nobody goes onto the ground unsupervised, not even members" part does have the side effect of 100 targets costing £50 ...

 

[MartynB]

It’s one thing to pick up the wrong Beretta 6- eighty- plonk from a rack of 12 clones,  I can see that happening . It is another thing to even touch a gun that does not belong to you .  It is just plain bad manners , a lack of etiquette if you like. You do have to wonder what the supervising “ Member “ of the group was thinking .  Also the club is negligent in how it handles it’s club guns . The guns should be “ behind the counter “ issued to a novice and recorded , what’s to stop anyone just popping one of the  “ club guns “ into a sleeve and buggering off with it ! 

 

[Will Hewland]

Though the "nobody goes onto the ground unsupervised, not even members" part does have the side effect of 100 targets costing £50 ...

Not always in fairness. If you count scorers as supervisors, then summer evening shooting is £28 per 100 and the registered shoots are £34.50. There is also a Monday morning no booking thing for £40 caddied! But yes, a usual caddied round to a non member is £50 or so, but hey, you get what you pay for, a professional environment and personal service.