Southdown SE Inter Counties 5/6 Apr

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CleverSC3 said:
And I'm really not biting back (btw do you know what vain means? Seems an irrelevant thing to say).

Anyway, what I am saying is that rather than rely on the system of 10% drop off, why not just put these sort of events on as the elite thing that they are and lose all reference to classification system. Then course setters can press on and make them what they need to be without fear of anybody moaning about difficulty (compared to the other shoots on elsewhere that day).
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I know what vain means, on line dictionary example, "a vain man with a streak of snobbery"...clay shooting can be a real leveller, you can have all the gear, expensive gun, a flash car, impeccable averages...and you still get beaten by a tradesman, shooting a Miroku and driving his works van!!! He has the advantage of not having to worry about anything other than shooting clays on Sunday...

 
James Johnston said:
I know what vain means, on line dictionary example, "a vain man with a streak of snobbery"...clay shooting can be a real leveller, you can have all the gear, expensive gun, a flash car, impeccable averages...and you still get beaten by a tradesman, shooting a Miroku and driving his works van!!! He has the advantage of not having to worry about anything other than shooting clays on Sunday...
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So you had to look it up and check then? :)

 
Jaykaysea said:
Why can't we shoot it knowing it is going to be tough?

Best practice being competition and all that? 
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Because if you make it Dubaiesque you simply won't get enough entries to make the numbers add up. Try it if you like, the year after selection courses designed for egos (sorry not referencing anyone in particular) you'll have just the 40 odd turn up who rightly believe they can make the team, the rest will go and shoot decent, firm but killable targets. 

Thirty years in it man and boy, and despite all the bravado and huff and puff about me like em hard, it's the normal shoots that get packed week in week out. 

I don't for one moment believe the vast majority of even AA's think they're in with a crack at making the team, hell 90% of them wouldn't have the funds or inclination to go to all the selections or turn up and shoot the big comps if you let them in with a wild card ! We shoot it knowing full well we're cannon fodder but expect a decent shoot in return. If you're so hooked on long birds buy a trap, drop it in a field and walk away till you run out of cable. 

ps. James, only you saw vanity and pretentiousness in Will's post. :umnik:

 
Well!

As a C class shooter, I see it like this.

The selection shoot was not what I was expecting, there was not a bird there that you actually could not hit or caused the the f**king hell feeling, this is going to be interesting. You could build a score but also drop a load of birds.

It was not many weeks ago that Southdown was crictised for putting on a hard fitasc. We know they have a couple of issues since Sean went but this is shooting grounds.

I find all this a little odd, owls lodge had a hard time for so say putting on a soft shoot a couple of months ago, however you need technique and method to build a score. Their last shoot they got crictised for it being to hard. the shoot was very technical and could destroy a card. I enjoyed it despite having 21 less on the card.

We all getting a little hung up on numbers....Master Solomons performance was brillant on Sunday the wind did effect the targets and the cream will always rise to the top on matter what targets are set. Soft hard or mild it's all about breaking clays and enjoying this little hobby.

If there had been 5. 100 straights and the classes won on a large amount above the class expected you could say it was a soft shoot.

The day a c class wins with a 100 straight then it might be a soft shoot!

 
Definitely don't think it should be limited to A or AA shots- the more the merrier, and gives everyone a good chance at experience, plus the chance to see how they measure up against the top levels.

All I'd say is that it should be set with an eye on the objective, which is to select the most competent team.

That was certainly the softest shoot I have seen for some years, and have no interest in averages, scores or rankings if I'm honest. Yes I want to be on the England team, but I also do the shoots expecting a decent challenge.

If every Sunday shoot was like that I would do something else!

 
Fair enough Tom. The issue is this though; when a shoot is tougher than 'normal', scores drop by about 5 clays for the very best shots (such as those likely to make a British team place or become British Champion). That same shoot may cause a middle level C class shot to drop around 25 clays more than normal). So, to make a shoot tough enough to REALLY sort the top folks, C class will be crucified. (Which most of them don't enjoy).

Sorry folks, to my other painful personality traits, I am now adding 'repetitive' :) I'll shut up on this thread now..

 
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CleverSC3 said:
I've never shot the Essex, but people tell me that is a medium to soft shoot. Strangely, it gets more entries than any other UK event.. Aimed at the masses. I'm not expressing an opinion here, just observing the economic reality of what and why. (Sorry, this should be on the Essex thread..)
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Will,

Do you beleive every thing that people tell you ???.......soft shoot ???, just look at the previous winners, all shots at the top of their game, never been won by a A,B or C class shooter...... But plenty shoot it for a little word that seems to get forgotten ...."FUN"

Maybe you should shoot it & experiance what 1300 others share .... :king:

 
philmoss said:
Will,

Do you beleive every thing that people tell you ???.......soft shoot ???, just look at the previous winners, all shots at the top of their game, never been won by a A,B or C class shooter...... But plenty shoot it for a little word that seems to get forgotten ...."FUN"

Maybe you should shoot it & experiance what 1300 others share .... :king:
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Regardless of how tough or easy a shoot is, the best shots will form a pool from which the winner will emerge of course. Yes the Essex relies on being fun to attract the massive entry. Perfect product for what it is trying to achieve? A course did get straighted a couple of years back if I recall. Fair enough, only one bloke managed it. (Oops. Just realised its the same thread. I'm really off now..)

 
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CleverSC3 said:
Regardless of how tough or easy a shoot is, the best shots will form a pool from which the winner will emerge of course. Yes the Essex relies on being fun to attract the massive entry. Perfect product for what it is trying to achieve? A course did get straighted a couple of years back if I recall. Fair enough, only one bloke managed it. (Oops. Just realised its the same thread. I'm really off now..)
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The other deciding factor is the strong prize fund for all class's & catergory's.

There have been a few top shots manage the golden egg of sporting 100/100 on a sunday of course, Sean Bramley shot the 1st course straight but never straighted both courses....

 
philmoss said:
Will,

Do you beleive every thing that people tell you ???.......soft shoot ???, just look at the previous winners, all shots at the top of their game, never been won by a A,B or C class shooter...... But plenty shoot it for a little word that seems to get forgotten ...."FUN"

Maybe you should shoot it & experiance what 1300 others share .... :king:
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I have to agree i shoot for fun.its nice to get a good score but if you dont.so what. its hardly life or death.i see shooters every week throwing their shells in the bins kicking the cages swearing just because they have missed a little black disc.if your not enjoying it why do it?

 
Speak as you find, I shot it on Saturday we had no breakdowns and I thought it was a good shoot.

 
i was just trying to prove a point from course setters point of view on this , but obviously it was taken the wrong way so now changed it 

 
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i was using it as an example will , no offence i hope , but hopefully folk will get what im trying to say ,

i actually heard from a good source in motor sport they were good , are they imported from china ???

 
No, stupidly it's all designed made and assembled in the UK.. :)

 
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Steve Lovatt said:
it dosent really matter whether it was easy , hard , technical , sloppy indifferent or what ever else , its been and gone so all look forward to the next wherever it might be 

one thing i can tell you is all the target setters i know do not go out to set a crap target , they all must think thats ok and its the job of the shooter to hit them .

it amazes me how in this industry we get applauded and can get criticised so much on so many things , target quality , bacon rolls , entry fee, car parks , etc ,etc .......

in clay shooters every day jobs are they forth coming on a forum to straighten things out , eg clever your gearboes are sh*t they blow up , clynt your oak joints are just too loose and you are too expensive £50 a day plenty for a man with a hammer and saw is plenty why should you profiteer , jim french your windows let draughts in , need i go on ,so come on folks its a shoot , shoot the clays ,hit as many as you can and smile and enjoy it .

steve
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Thanks for not saying all bank managers are gits.....

Good points Steve....

Jkc xx

 
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