single versatile layout and trap for both ABT and DTL?

[steve098]

Hi,

at the local shooting ground, we have enough land for one layout. We are in Scotland, so the most common discipline is DTL, but we'd like to shoot ABT on the same layout too...so are looking for some imaginitive ideas to make the one ground suitable for both disciplines - or at least something close (we're not looking to host registered shoots).

The SCTA/CPSA publish specs for the two disciplines

http://www.scta.co.uk/index.php/clayshooting/39-clay-shooting-disciplines

Things like markers in the field and the placement of shooting stations are easy to overcome, but the hurdles to having a dual-use ground are, at first glance:

1) the mechanics of the trap.

A quick g.oogle shows that you can buy ABT/DTL traps. I assume you just turn off the vertical wobble  and wind down the tension spring for DTL?

2) the traphouse height.

I think this is the biggest problem:

DTL traphouse sits on the same level as the shooting stands. ABT has the roof of the traphouse at the level of the shooting ground - like a dugout. (I can't see exact details of the size of the traphouse for how far below groundlevel the trap arm should be...)

We could have a 'bodge' for the ABT and just have the traphouse sat as per DTL. I guess we would have to adjust the targets so the traphouse didn't obscure the lowest angle shots (1m above the level)...?

or we could have a long platform built for the ABT shooting stations for people to stand on  to lift them up to the same height. I think they would just squeeze in behind the DTL stations...

Another option would be to mount the trap on a moveable plate that we could jack up and down, and have the traphouse built over a pit extending below the ground level. We could lower the trap so the throwing arm is level with the ground for ABT, and raise it up for DTL. We'd have to have the traphouse extending above ground level still for DTL...?

3) trap location within the hut

DTL appears to launch from inside the hut (good for the scottish weather to keep the rain off the trap!), but ABT understandably has the arm of the trap at the front edge of the traphouse - I guess so that the lofty targets don't hit the traphouse roof. I don't know how crucial this is...?

Has anyone any imaginitive solutions or ideas?

thanks

Steve

 

[** Pending Removal **]

The ABT shooters will not want to see a trap house, they have a bunker,  but the DTL shooters will want to see a trap house.

Gosh this is a tricky one. Maybe a removeable trap housing and trap for the DTL and the ABT in a bunker in front of where the trap house for DTL would sit.

You need 40UP to help with this one. 

 

[Dog Tyred]

Set it up for ABT only! The DTL shooters will soon convert

Seriously set it up as ABT and have the DTL trap and house mounted on a small trailer which will park on top of the ABT layout. Simples!

Not the cheapest option I grant you but best for both disciplines.

DT

 

[40UP]

To use the one trap economically you mount it in the base of a freestanding DTL house with liftable lid and provided your water table is ok lift or lower it to ground level with jacks or front loader. Target release system would be Canterbury voice. Trap position would be ABT which would accommodate DTL.

 

[Les53]

To use the one trap economically you mount it in the base of a freestanding DTL house with liftable lid and provided your water table is ok lift or lower it to ground level with jacks or front loader. Target release system would be Canterbury voice. Trap position would be ABT which would accommodate DTL.

Nice one Fred!!!!!

 

[Dog Tyred]

Yeah but then you have to dick about with angles, spring tension, etc depending on what your are shooting.

Or you could do like my local club and leave everything the same for both disciplines except turn the elevation variation motor off when shooting DTL !!

DT

 

[steve098]

thanks all for your contributions.

It looks like the solution would be some sort of removable DTL traphouse to sit on top of an ABT pit.

We'd probably put postholes in the ground for the corners of the traphouse, then have metal-framed corrugated panels to slot into place for the 3 walls, and the roof from the pit. Jack the trap up to ground level, wind down the spring, disable the vertical motor, and bob's your uncle ...or would we have to swap the spring out altogether between DTL and ABT?

I see the shooting stations for ABT are in a straight line, and DTL arranged in an arc around the trap. This is easily accommodated with some painted squares or rubber pads on a concrete apron.

The changeover doesn't need to be quick; I envisage shooting DTL one week, ABT the next etc.

thanks again

Steve

 

[steve098]

Yeah but then you have to dick about with angles, spring tension, etc depending on what your are shooting.

Or you could do like my local club and leave everything the same for both disciplines except turn the elevation variation motor off when shooting DTL !!

DT

Ha! I can see this happening too!

 

[ips]

Abt used to be same peg layout as Dtl but some arse about 20yrs ago decided to change this too.

 

[magnum3]

just a thought if you had a collapsible trap house for dtl you could have the dtl trap on rails so it could be pulled back in front off abt shooter on peg 3 and make universal peg stands marked out for abt and dtl something for thought

wullie s

 

[Les53]

Abt used to be same peg layout as Dtl but some arse about 20yrs ago decided to change this too.

Yeah, god knows why!!!! These days it seems as though there is very little to choose between ABT, UT and OT. They are all throwing targets that are pretty viscious, even ABT which used to be a little easier than the other two, seems to be getting harder, well that's what I've been told by those that still shoot it. I'm not too sure about UT, never really shotmuch of it to be honest, maybe only two or three times a long while back. It seems as though ABT, UT and OT can all throw up to about 75mtr targets as far as I know, but I'm sure I've shot at OT targets that go beyond that! Maybe it's my imagination or maybe I'm just getting old!  Some layouts at SC seem to throw hard right OT birds that could easily be near breaking the sound barrier, or at least that's how they seem! :laugh:

 

[magnum3]

vip I totally agree with you the older you get unless you try and keep yourself fit you cannot swing the gun as fast as you used too,they are all going away targets and you shoot them up the ass

they are not flying faster than the shot appr. 1500 ft/sec how can one miss

 

[Les53]

vip I totally agree with you the older you get unless you try and keep yourself fit you cannot swing the gun as fast as you used too,they are all going away targets and you shoot them up the ass
they are not flying faster than the shot appr. 1500 ft/sec how can one miss

How can one mis?????? Well eerr.....do you shoot OT on a regular basis? How do you manage not to miss at OT? I was told many years ago,by a very wise shooter,that those who shoot OT are either gifted or insane! I'm not gifted!!!!! .!

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Well Les....one never misses until one is in competition...... L. O. L.

 

[Les53]

Well Les....one never misses until one is in competition...... L. O. L.

Well Les....one never misses until one is in competition...... L. O. L.

I can miss at ANY time Nic.......its dead easy! .!

 

[** Pending Removal **]

That was my point..... L. O. L.

Especially at Helice where you do not know which trap or direction..... :smile:

 

[Les53]

That was my point..... L. O. L.
Especially at Helice where you do not know which trap or direction..... :smile:

Bit like OT Nic,all you know is that it will come out of the trench like a bat out of hell, but no clue as to what angle or height! I guess that's what keeps me interested!

 

[magnum3]

How can one mis?????? Well eerr.....do you shoot OT on a regular basis? How do you manage not to miss at OT? I was told many years ago,by a very wise shooter,that those who shoot OT are either gifted or insane! I'm not gifted!!!!! .!

hi .  no I was not implying I could shoot all at ot ,I was implying that when you see the target flying in a straight direction out in front of you that very seldom deviates in flight it almost looks impossible to miss with the speed of modern day cartridges    

cheers

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Ah......almost looks impossible to miss....

I agree :laugh: