recoil

[jwpzx9r]

Without being too harsh the subject of recoil is one of those where unless you're personally affected to the degree of having to seek ways of reducing it, you simply wouldn't have the benefit of either experience, knowledge or wisdom to comment in a constructive way.

I don't think you can reduce recoil. You might feel less but the gun still recoils in the same way regardless of what you put on the back of it. I think the best way of getting relief from recoil is to hold the gun properly and use a cartridge that causes the least amount of recoil ... so as ips said a lighter load and a well fitted gun should help a lot. It is a fact that you will see very few really top shots using the devises being touted here.

I will quote Scotty from Start Trek ye canny break the laws of physics   and the slightly built individual will always suffer more than a heavy built person.

 

[ips]

So what your recommending John is to eat more pies ?

 

[Wonko the Sane]

Along with considerations of gun fit, I've noticed that people often mount the gun in a manner not at all conducive to absorbing recoil.  Creaky as I am these days, recoil is still not a problem.  I'm guessing that proper gun fit and mount have some considerable impact (see how I worked that in?) on that being the case. 

just a thot

that and eating more pies of course

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Pies......Mmmmmmmmm ...where....who has them......hand them over to the class monitor NOW...!!

Yum yum...

 

[jwpzx9r]

"they add between 7 - 14 oz, no real problem in any case because as we know."

That is about 10% of the mass of a HEAVY gun... that in its self will have an effect on the RECOIL  not what you feel but the actual recoil of the gun.... so buy a heavier gun   ... and of course eat them pies!

 

[Hamster]

I will quote Scotty from Start Trek ye canny break the laws of physics   and the slightly built individual will always suffer more than a heavy built person.

Perfectly plausible yet wrong or at the very least highly flawed assumption, like so many facts in shooting. As I keep saying fit and cartridge are indeed important but they are not the complete answer to everything, there comes a time when you need to go one step beyond, madness I know but it suggs to be in that situation.

I would have had to pretty much stop shooting decades ago if I hadn't taken every step in recoil management as and when it became available. One of my friends who no longer shoots comes from a family of big brothers yet he used to hand load 24g shells as the recoil hurt his shoulder so much, this was before anything other than normal Sorbothane pads were available - I at the same time used to simply live with the issue because recoil has never bothered my joints, shoulder, neck, cheek or back, only headaches. I'd even wear baggy trousers if it helped.

 

[Hamster]

"they add between 7 - 14 oz, no real problem in any case because as we know."

That is about 10% of the mass of a HEAVY gun... that in its self will have an effect on the RECOIL  not what you feel but the actual recoil of the gun.... so buy a heavier gun   ... and of course eat them pies!

Have you ever fired one of these things ?

 

[Hamster]

Will, I'd have expected you to like the other post or are you pretending to be too young ? :danced:

 

[Will Hewland]

Sorry wasn't paying attention! What you were saying was one step beyond my recognition..

 

[Skeet UK]

Without being too harsh the subject of recoil is one of those where unless you're personally affected to the degree of having to seek ways of reducing it, you simply wouldn't have the benefit of either experience, knowledge or wisdom to comment in a constructive way.

I don't think you can reduce recoil. You might feel less but the gun still recoils in the same way regardless of what you put on the back of it. I think the best way of getting relief from recoil is to hold the gun properly and use a cartridge that causes the least amount of recoil ... so as ips said a lighter load and a well fitted gun should help a lot. It is a fact that you will see very few really top shots using the devises being touted here.

I will quote Scotty from Start Trek ye canny break the laws of physics   and the slightly built individual will always suffer more than a heavy built person.

You seem to have a rudimentary understanding of Newtonian physics, but you are being a pedant regarding the terms we are using.

NO, we cannot make the ISOLATED gun, recoil at a lower rate, but it is recoiling AGAINST the reducer, which dissipates some of the energy...actually, LOTS of the energy.

http://www.recoilsystems.co.uk/ISISlight/recoilgraph-large.htm

Horses mouth.

I am the designer and manufacturer of the ISIS Recoil Reducer and other recoil related products. My credentials for those who are interested, I am a qualified engineer who has spent a great deal of time designing and developing equipment using hydraulic shock absorbers. On the shooting front, I have shot clays at International level for more than 30 years. I have shot World and European competitions as a member of the GB FITASC squad and at English Sporting as a member of the England team. My experience in trap is more limited as I shoot it when time allows, 200-400 shells a week at Olympic trap or universal trench. Most weekends, I shoot FITASC or English sporting. For trap I use a K-80 or a Perazzi MX10 obviously with all the ISIS systems and products fitted and for FITASC and English sporting, I use a Beretta 391 semi-auto also with all the ISIS products fitted. I am AA at English Sporting, A at FITASC and the worst trap shooter in the country but I love the discipline!

Shotgun recoil is a difficult problem to quantify. The very high speed of the recoil pulse 1/40th of a second and the high impact force

280 lbs/ft for a 1oz load makes the understanding of what actually happens very difficult. The actual pulse is too fast for us to sense properly and when you consider that a top athlete at best can react in only 1/10th of a second, we mere mortals have no chance of performing any better. Quite often what feels right is not necessarily so. Sometimes the true impact to the shooter goes unnoticed because of the speed of the pulse. It only shows up later during the shoot or the next day with stiff neck or shoulders. In later life, rheumatism, arthritis or problems from general wear and tear can be aggravated. For my own part, I have a crushed disc at the base of my spine, damaged and worn discs and knuckles in my neck (left hand side as I am a right hand shooter). I actually got to the point of giving up shooting about 8 years ago when I could not pull the trigger on my semi auto even with light 7/8oz loads. Whenever I develop a product, I firstly try to make the recoil as comfortable as possible from a physical point of view. Then, using high speed photography and pressure mapping establish exactly what the gun and shooter are doing under recoil. Quite often what feels right is not so and products that bounce energy off the shooter rather than absorbing or using that energy are not good. Whilst the perception of recoil may be better, other problems of gun movement and rib/eye alignment can be affected. I hope this is of interest to you and thank you for taking the time to read it.

Shoot well and above all enjoy it!

David Izzard

 

[jwpzx9r]

Horse something right enough ... but hey he flogs them he must be right!

 

[Skeet UK]

Horse something right enough ... but hey he flogs them he must be right!

Possibly, but that still doesn't change the fact that you are not able to understand how a recoil reducer works...when clearly they do.

How do you suppose a Naval gun, firing 18 inch shells, manages to:

a ) Not change the course of the ship and 

b ) Not rip the gun from the carriage?

Oh and . . . '&do=embed' frameborder='0' data-embedContent>>

 

[jwpzx9r]

Have you ever fired one of these things ?

What a heavy gun or one with a recoil reducer ? I do shoot a reasonably heavy gun at 3.965Kg and don't use a recoil mebob. My gun fits well and the cartridges (CleverT2 28g) I use are what I would call low recoil. I can shoot anything from 150 to 200 in a bit over 3hrs and I do not suffer from recoil issues. I stress I shoot trap my gun mount is not too bad and I have never seen anybody use one down here for trap...ever. Anyway I am sorry the OP has a problem but has he had his gun mount and fit checked out ?

 

[Skeet UK]

On a lighter note . . . 

 

[Hamster]

What a heavy gun or one with a recoil reducer ? I do shoot a reasonably heavy gun at 3.965Kg and don't use a recoil mebob. My gun fits well and the cartridges (CleverT2 28g) I use are what I would call low recoil. I can shoot anything from 150 to 200 in a bit over 3hrs and I do not suffer from recoil issues. I stress I shoot trap my gun mount is not too bad and I have never seen anybody use one down here for trap...ever. Anyway I am sorry the OP has a problem but has he had his gun mount and fit checked out ?

If you shoot two otherwise identical guns one with one without you will find they recoil the same amount as Isaac said they would but that the one with the device will cause less discomfort / concussion over the course of the day because it spreads the recoil pulse and dissipates some of it as heat plus of course compressing the spring, oil or air. 

If they gave you ten 42g shells and asked that you fire them off either one every hour or one after the other in under a minute, which would you choose ? Extreme example but serves to demonstrate how lengthening the shot signature is useful. 

 

[chippy]

Without being too harsh the subject of recoil is one of those where unless you're personally affected to the degree of having to seek ways of reducing it, you simply wouldn't have the benefit of either experience, knowledge or wisdom to comment in a constructive way.

I don't think you can reduce recoil. You might feel less but the gun still recoils in the same way regardless of what you put on the back of it. I think the best way of getting relief from recoil is to hold the gun properly and use a cartridge that causes the least amount of recoil ... so as ips said a lighter load and a well fitted gun should help a lot. It is a fact that you will see very few really top shots using the devises being touted here.

I will quote Scotty from Start Trek ye canny break the laws of physics   and the slightly built individual will always suffer more than a heavy built person.

I've never suffered with recoil problems myself and now i know why. i did not realise it hit lightweights worse.

 

[EdSolomons]

I know plenty of big lads who have had recoil issues so that's one "fact" out the window.

As has been said previously, if you haven't suffered recoil problems then great, carry on.

BUT you aren't really in a position to offer advice to others as your perception of it is rather skewed. Many people suffer with it in many ways, big and small. I've never had a problem, but will go out of my way to keep everything as soft as possible as a prevention rather than cure.

It goes way beyond fit and shell if you are interested in minimising its effects.

 

[westley]

And it is for just this reason that I always conduct a 'first' shooting lesson using 21 or 24 grams through my Beretta 391 auto, even though I have been critisized by other so called Instructors for using such a gun !  I have yet to have anyone complain about recoil and they nearly always come back for more.

 

[Nick Selby]

On a lighter note . . . 

looks like her glutes take a lot of the recoil......

 

[jwpzx9r]

"I've never suffered with recoil problems myself and now i know why. i did not realise it hit lightweights worse."

Well while I prepare for the flaming here is an not totally representative but not unrepresentative... example but you will get the gist.

If you were 10st soaking wet and you went shot for shot with Mike Tyson who would have the slight ringing in their ears at the end of the experiment?

Just my take but many people who do suffer recoil issues are most likely.

A) light body weight using unsuitable cartridges.

A) plus B. Do not hold their gun properly because it does not fit well

B. plus C) scared of their gun when it fires because it hurts them... no surprise there!

Simple thing is gun moves back on firing you have to support that movement. You have a much better out come if you have high body mass, there is no play in the system and the gun fits well you have a good stance and you are using a realistic cartridge.