Maintained Lead.

[VicW]

Chard,  Many thanks for the diagrams,very helpful except for one thing.

The shooting ground I mostly shoot at puts on loopers but the ground doesn't have any of those vertical lines hanging down to judge the break point by !!

Vic.

 

[Chard]

Chard,  Many thanks for the diagrams,very helpful except for one thing.

The shooting ground I mostly shoot at puts on loopers but the ground doesn't have any of those vertical lines hanging down to judge the break point by !!

Vic.

Just draw them on your shooting glasses. Works a treat

 

[VicW]

Just draw them on your shooting glasses. Works a treat

Damn good idea but I can't do that,I'll get all confused with the horizontal ones for shooting underneath rabbits !!

Vic.

 

[paul b]

Just draw them on your shooting glasses. Works a treat

someone just asked me the time,so i said its 9.30,i now it is because i wrote it down this morning  

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Draw the zoro one now showing your chopping down one...... Don't forget your highlighter pen......I know how you love your Facebook highlighter pen...... L. O. L.

 

[arichardc]

Maintained lead may have its place a sporting shooter's toolbox.  However, many excellent skeet shooters maintain it is the only way.

 

[cassiusclays]

Just shoot the way you feel comfortable.

I shoot all methods at varying targets, when it feels right for me. listening to too many people can screw your head up.

If you are shooting like sh*t find a good coach who will help you develope your own method by working with you.

If he starts the sesion with the words ' The method I teach'. Unless your going to spend a lot of time and money with them you might find it can mess your head up.

Or you might find a miricle happens.

Just keep an open mind and what feels right usually is.

 

[Gil Ash]

our research has brought us to two conclusions.....one...all skill lies in the sub conscious brain and two....all targets are missed due to muzzle awareness at some level....either in the set up or during the shot....we see most shooters trying to get the gun ahead of the target and "not look at the gun".....for the life of me i have yet to find anyone who can tell me how to visualize "not looking at something "....and the more you try not to look at something guess what.....the more you look at it....especially when the  pressure is on....what we have found is most methods rely on gun speed for consistency....as the pressure mounts what happens to the gun speed.....most of the time it don't slow down

we have had great success with shooters at all levels emphasizing two things.....what it really looks like with the gun mounted in front of the clay and inserting a little too far in front of the clay and then adjusting the gun speed to the clays speed and when the picture is stable shoot.....to see what it really looks like place two cups on a book shelf 18 inches apart and look at one and mount the gun on the other.....looking at the left one and mounting the gun on the right one (THE LEFT TO RIGHT SIGHT PICTURE) you will find you are actually looking to the left of the muzzles and when looking at the right one and mounting the gun on the left one(THE RIGHT TO LEFT SIGHT PICTURE) you will find you will be looking ACROSS THE MUZZLES....most shooters are shocked to see what this actually looks like and after a bit of practice begin to accept the muzzle in the picture......this along with changing the way we describe the picture has amazing results.....how do we change the description.....

.well we all can agree that the gun must be in front of the target but this leads to getting the gun in front and "trying not to look at it" which cannot be visualized.....if however we look at the same picture from the point of view of looking at the bird BEHIND THE MUZZLE then we have found that the eyes have accepted the muzzle in the picture but now the eyes have a place to be....either looking to the left of the barrels at the target or across the barrels to the right.....this can be visualized in your pre shot routine and the muzzle although there seems to not draw your attention like it does when you are trying not to look at it....this descript from the perspective of a right handed shooter..... cant stress enough practicing the sight pictures with the two cups....this does make the muzzle become much less dominate .....it is as if you eyes are not surprised by the muzzle anymore.....

the other huge thing that happens is the targets all slow down and appear to go the same speed because they are all coming to you and as you adjust the gun speed to the targets speed the target floats.....cheers...

 

[Will Hewland]

Are you pissed?

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Welcome Gil.

I am going to love reading your posts.

Can I suggest you have a tin hat ready at the side of the computer at all times.

Some do not adjust well to people knowing their stuff and there does tend to be disagreements :smile: .

But like you I like long posts with plenty of info when needed.

Welcome again. :smile:

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Oh dear CleverSC3..... Not very polite.

See what I mean Gil.....!!

 

[Will Hewland]

Oh dear CleverSC3..... Not very polite.

See what I mean Gil.....!!

I should be more expansive, not to mention polite. However, reducing the whole complex matter of why a target is missed (presumably to every shooter in the world) to 'looking at the muzzle' is ridiculous in extremis. And from somebody that writes books about it? thats just worrying. Sure, it's one cause, especially with newbies, but hundreds of other reasons ought to be considered just a little?

 

[** Pending Removal **]

Often that is exactly why people miss in trap or in anything else CleverSC4....They look at the barrel and the speed slows down.

Simples.

P.s. I need to add a rider here......it is not the only reason they miss.

 

[Gil Ash]

name some others??????GA

 

[Clanchief]

Often that is exactly why people miss in trap or in anything else CleverSC4....They look at the barrel and the speed slows down.
Simples.
P.s. I need to add a rider here......it is not the only reason they miss.

Been through this in the last year, look at bead stop the gun and miss, countless shots after a lesson showed this and a year down the line, oh and to mention again in the same day Gils video don't look down the barrels, watched it dozens of times at work. Now I do not see any bead or barrels, and as stated last week shot better and more natural without my glasses with the ocular spot.

Nic what is adding a rider ?

 

[Emmsy]

Are you pissed?

well i thought it was a decent post considering some of the drivel on the last 11 pages.

 

[Clynt]

our research has brought us to two conclusions.....one...all skill lies in the sub conscious brain and two....all targets are missed due to muzzle awareness at some level....either in the set up or during the shot....we see most shooters trying to get the gun ahead of the target and "not look at the gun".....for the life of me i have yet to find anyone who can tell me how to visualize "not looking at something "....and the more you try not to look at something guess what.....the more you look at it....especially when the  pressure is on....what we have found is most methods rely on gun speed for consistency....as the pressure mounts what happens to the gun speed.....most of the time it don't slow down

we have had great success with shooters at all levels emphasizing two things.....what it really looks like with the gun mounted in front of the clay and inserting a little too far in front of the clay and then adjusting the gun speed to the clays speed and when the picture is stable shoot.....to see what it really looks like place two cups on a book shelf 18 inches apart and look at one and mount the gun on the other.....looking at the left one and mounting the gun on the right one (THE LEFT TO RIGHT SIGHT PICTURE) you will find you are actually looking to the left of the muzzles and when looking at the right one and mounting the gun on the left one(THE RIGHT TO LEFT SIGHT PICTURE) you will find you will be looking ACROSS THE MUZZLES....most shooters are shocked to see what this actually looks like and after a bit of practice begin to accept the muzzle in the picture......this along with changing the way we describe the picture has amazing results.....how do we change the description.....

.well we all can agree that the gun must be in front of the target but this leads to getting the gun in front and "trying not to look at it" which cannot be visualized.....if however we look at the same picture from the point of view of looking at the bird BEHIND THE MUZZLE then we have found that the eyes have accepted the muzzle in the picture but now the eyes have a place to be....either looking to the left of the barrels at the target or across the barrels to the right.....this can be visualized in your pre shot routine and the muzzle although there seems to not draw your attention like it does when you are trying not to look at it....this descript from the perspective of a right handed shooter..... cant stress enough practicing the sight pictures with the two cups....this does make the muzzle become much less dominate .....it is as if you eyes are not surprised by the muzzle anymore.....

the other huge thing that happens is the targets all slow down and appear to go the same speed because they are all coming to you and as you adjust the gun speed to the targets speed the target floats.....cheers...

very interesting and valid points

 

[** Pending Removal **]

name some others??????GA

Well Gil with me I can just have a complete cock up. Lack of concentration, lifting head, anything from a long list.
:smile:

P.s. Forgot to add above .... 'good post Gil'.

 

[Chipper]

Personally Gil that statement makes a lot of sense & good reading

 

[jake.keeling]

Gil I know what your getting at, but surely I am only looking over the muzzle (although I would say over the rib with bigger leads) with my left eye when looking at target coming from the right, My right eye has an unrestricted view directly at the target. I can see where the rib is pointing when looking at target, this is not looking at rib, or is that what you mean? I have shot targets looking at something on the ground while the target is in the sky, all in peripheral, just shows how amazing your vision and brain is.