Should we all shoot 24g cartridges

[jwpzx9r]

Not me, I know I can can miss just as well with 21g   

You can actually miss easier with 21g loads . You have to be more accurate to break the target with a 21g load you only have 75% of the shot in the same pattern area so the effective area of the pattern is reduced . Although the reduced recoil may possibly give a better chance of a second barrel hit.

 

[AW13]

You can actually miss easier with 21g loads . You have to be more accurate to break the target with a 21g load you only have 75% of the shot in the same pattern area so the effective area of the pattern is reduced . Although the reduced recoil may possibly give a better chance of a second barrel hit.

That is an interesting comment. If you  shoot 24g or 21g should you consider  going up one choke constriction to help mitigate less shot and give you a better pattern ? 

This sounds like it can really mess with your head.

 

[Will Hewland]

You can actually miss easier with 21g loads . You have to be more accurate to break the target with a 21g load you only have 75% of the shot in the same pattern area so the effective area of the pattern is reduced . Although the reduced recoil may possibly give a better chance of a second barrel hit.

Your first sentence I agree with. However, I found that 21g are not less dense, it’s more that they produce a smaller pattern. In other words, the missing 7g of pellets (over a 28g) are those on the outside of the pattern. That’s why they make great kills when you put the gun in the right place. It’s more like shooting tight choke, but without the density. (Having said that, each cartridge is a bit different, so pattern to be sure). 

 

[rocky]

You can actually miss easier with 21g loads . You have to be more accurate to break the target with a 21g load you only have 75% of the shot in the same pattern area so the effective area of the pattern is reduced . Although the reduced recoil may possibly give a better chance of a second barrel hit.

I totally agree fella, my serious answer would be that after a year or so reading on here & other forums before I even picked up a shotgun I formed the opinion that it would be better to learn to shoot with a small load and half chokes (as opposed to full loads & 1/4 chokes like some beginners) to force me to shoot more accurately as it will help me later. 

Mind you, on a couple of the practice stands I’ve been playing on I’ve been tempted to take a swipe with the butt of the gun  

 

[jwpzx9r]

Your first sentence I agree with. However, I found that 21g are not less dense, it’s more that they produce a smaller pattern. In other words, the missing 7g of pellets (over a 28g) are those on the outside of the pattern. That’s why they make great kills when you put the gun in the right place. It’s more like shooting tight choke, but without the density. (Having said that, each cartridge is a bit different, so pattern to be sure). 

No argument from me Will BUT if you are thinking about the general pattern size of a 28g shell then the effective area is reduced. I think about it as a 28g shell having an effective diameter of 750mm at 30m whereas the 21g will give an effective  pattern  of 600mm ish because of what you have highlighted. I broke a target at the weekend that simply broke into two pieces using a 28g load... if I had a mortgage I would put it on the fact I would never had touched that clay had I been shooting a 21g load due to the fact I was well off the center of the pattern .

 

[buze]

As far as recoil goes, a while back i tried pretty much anything 24g I could get my hands on, and I never found any of these with less recoil than my 28g CompX fiber. I tried (again) TT1s 24g over the week-end and sure enough, still kickier than the old compx.

So there is more to recoil than just the amount of lead, the powder they pack it is very likely a more important factor.

That and also wether your gun is backbored/overbored, length of the forcing cones, which chokes you use and so on and so forth. fun!

 

[Will Hewland]

As far as recoil goes, a while back i tried pretty much anything 24g I could get my hands on, and I never found any of these with less recoil than my 28g CompX fiber. I tried (again) TT1s 24g over the week-end and sure enough, still kickier than the old compx.

So there is more to recoil than just the amount of lead, the powder they pack it is very likely a more important factor.

That and also wether your gun is backbored/overbored, length of the forcing cones, which chokes you use and so on and so forth. fun!

CompX are the lowest recoil 28g though..

 

[buze]

CompX are the lowest recoil 28g though..

My entire point is that they are lowest recoil *including 24g* carts...

 

[El Spavo]

I totally agree fella, my serious answer would be that after a year or so reading on here & other forums before I even picked up a shotgun I formed the opinion that it would be better to learn to shoot with a small load and half chokes (as opposed to full loads & 1/4 chokes like some beginners) to force me to shoot more accurately as it will help me later. 

Oooh, I motioned that possibility for newbies when I first joined on here after reading a few bits and pieces and got a resounding "doesn't work like that"!

 

[AW13]

Tomorrow will be interesting as I will be out practicing with a fixed choke 1/4 & 1/2 with a hard butt plate on a wide variety of presentations and maybe a bit of skeet to finish with.  I will be comparing 24g Evo 8's with Express Power Blue 28g 8's.

will I be aware of any major difference or will it be a close call?  

 

[MartynB]

For what it’s worth I think you will . 3 of us did a simulated driven day . As you can shoot 80 shells in a 10 minute drive a nice shooting shell is paramount to me  We had, between three of us sharing a peg .  3 slabs of Oly Blue and a slab of Power Blue Blues  . At some point they got mixed  in the cartridge bags as we were just splitting the cost . The Power Blue were noticeably thumping more  , and that’s through a 38 trap gun , with a Kickeeze  pad

 

[rocky]

Oooh, I motioned that possibility for newbies when I first joined on here after reading a few bits and pieces and got a resounding "doesn't work like that"!

Well a very experienced shooterist comes out with me sometimes and he wants me to learn to hit the middle of the clay - he doesn’t care what load I use. 

 

[jwpzx9r]

Well a very experienced shooterist comes out with me sometimes and he wants me to learn to hit the middle of the clay - he doesn’t care what load I use. 

Well it is something that comes with time and practice... but you have to remember that even the most seasoned target shooter does not always get the target into the center of the pattern, yes you naturally want to have good breaks BUT I would take 25 chipped targets every time if I was in a competition  :lol:

 

[Will Hewland]

Tomorrow will be interesting as I will be out practicing with a fixed choke 1/4 & 1/2 with a hard butt plate on a wide variety of presentations and maybe a bit of skeet to finish with.  I will be comparing 24g Evo 8's with Express Power Blue 28g 8's.

will I be aware of any major difference or will it be a close call?  

If you can’t tell the difference between those then I would see a doctor..

 

[AW13]

So.. this morning I shot a wide variety of targets and only really had one slight surprise.

Recoil was much more noticeable using the 28g -  as expected.

Patterns and kills were to my observation were very similar to the extent that I could not determine any real difference.

Muzzle flip was the biggest surprise. The muzzle flip for 28g was much more noticeable than the 24g whether fired from the top or bottom barrel.  It was particularly noticeable when shooting sim pairs that needed a quick 2nd shot.

In summary, if recoil is a problem for you then 24g makes sense and if you want to reduce muzzle flip then again 24g is logical. 

I will use the remaining 24g slabs and then decide what to buy.  I am leaning towards 24g for the O/U and keep 28g for my semi auto.

 

[Will Hewland]

So.. this morning I shot a wide variety of targets and only really had one slight surprise.

Recoil was much more noticeable using the 28g -  as expected.

Patterns and kills were to my observation were very similar to the extent that I could not determine any real difference.

Muzzle flip was the biggest surprise. The muzzle flip for 28g was much more noticeable than the 24g whether fired from the top or bottom barrel.  It was particularly noticeable when shooting sim pairs that needed a quick 2nd shot.

In summary, if recoil is a problem for you then 24g makes sense and if you want to reduce muzzle flip then again 24g is logical. 

I will use the remaining 24g slabs and then decide what to buy.  I am leaning towards 24g for the O/U and keep 28g for my semi auto.

All good. But if you suffer muzzle flip it’s only exaggerated, not caused by, the cartridges. Gun fit (or how you mount) is the usual culprit. A poor recoil pad (especially an old kickeez) won’t help.

 

[AW13]

I was shooting an MK60 with a sold but pad. And I guess my gun mount is not always perfect 

 

[Jan Powell]

Muzzle flip was the biggest surprise. The muzzle flip for 28g was much more noticeable than the 24g whether fired from the top or bottom barrel. 

That'll most likely be down to a poor mount, poor gun fit or a gun that's excessively light in the barrels. The difference between a 24 and 28g load shouldn't be that significant.

Muzzle flip will always be a little more noticeable through the top barrel anyway.

 

[AW13]

That'll most likely be down to a poor mount, poor gun fit or a gun that's excessively light in the barrels. The difference between a 24 and 28g load shouldn't be that significant.

Muzzle flip will always be a little more noticeable through the top barrel anyway.

I think you are correct, I was swapping cartridges between barrels and also swapping shooting over or under in various combinations, now I think about it I think I noticed 'more flip' when shooting the top barrel first.

also the gun has fixed chokes and balances perfectly on the pin, and I tend to have a soft forward grip, might contributing factors

 

[jwpzx9r]

All good. But if you suffer muzzle flip it’s only exaggerated, not caused by, the cartridges. Gun fit (or how you mount) is the usual culprit. A poor recoil pad (especially an old kickeez) won’t help.

Or the pitch of the gun is not right?