Effect of moving comb?

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Point of aim and point of impact are two different things- don't be confused..!

 
mx8, splash your cash, book a lesson with him or Ben or another 'GOOD' coach and they will show/explain it much better than they can on a forum...

 
Yes lots of 'good' coaches around.

Also lots of people who will give you advice who have only been shooting 2 minutes.

As I tell my chaps......if someone you dont know....gives you a tip while you are shooting.....just smile and say thank you....then ignore it and carry on perfecting what you should be doing......that way everyone is happy :)

.....just saying....!!

 
I'd just like to add advice on choosing your "good" coach.

Choose him/her by their reputation as a coach not necessarily for their reputation as a shooter.

Some of the best coaches I've ever met were not known for their shooting prowess. I'm thinking of guys like Chris Craddock, Sam Wilkinson, Roger Silcox or Terry Fricker. All at the top of their game in their day but I don't think any of them challenged for a major title. Some people out there are relying on their personal shooting record to gain a reputation in the coaching field.

The two can exist together however as I've never heard a bad word said about Ed Solomons on here (or anywhere else), and apparently he's known for breaking a few targets himself too!!  :biggrin:

 
Well I have to disagree with you Top 1 dog. (And as I have a leg in both camps....I can) :wink:

In all the big push Academy projects......like Phil Coley's .......the majority of the coaches have no formal coaching qualifications (cpsa or otherwise) only 2 when I last looked......yet the rest are all big winners.

We have had this conversation on forums many times.......and my view has never changed.....and that is.......IF YOU WANT TO WIN....you get coaching from someone who has been there and done it and has 'the medals and cups' .......because I can assure you......ONLY the competing coach (whether still competing or not) knows how to win and has all the tools to be there.

Sorry if this clashes with the view of some really good competent coaches out there....who have not won anything....or have won a bit in the UK....(or the majority of cpsa coaches who have won diddly squat - except for the very special few).

 
Generally speaking; raising the comb, lowers the back of the gun...which points the barrels up at more of an angle...which means you will see more rib and the gun will tend to shoot higher.

skeet

I am mystified at this statement can you tell me how raising the comb of a shotgun does this? I shoot trap and mount my gun on the same part of my shoulder every time I mount my gun and then bring my head down onto the stock, how can raising the comb have any effect on the angle of my gun?

 
I will agree with you Nicola on your last post here.

However, the point I was trying to put across was that there are several very good shooters who coudn't teach anyone to tie up their shoelaces, but would go out and win a competition at the drop of a hat. A good shooter does not always equal a good coach because of this alone.

A good coach will teach you to shoot well, but I am perfectly in agreement that you need a "special" coach to take you across that line into winning championships, and that coach would have to know what that takes themselves.

I've just seen so many people paying for coaching from a known shooter to be told "you're behind it mate" ££££££Kerrrrchinggggg! And it annoys me no end. :biggrin:

 
In my head, keeping it simple:

A great shot could be a great or a terrible coach.

A poor shot is extremely unlikely to be even a reasonable coach.

Only a great coach who HAS been successful in competition would ever inspire me.

 
jwpzx9r said:
Generally speaking; raising the comb, lowers the back of the gun...which points the barrels up at more of an angle...which means you will see more rib and the gun will tend to shoot higher.

skeet

I am mystified at this statement can you tell me how raising the comb of a shotgun does this? I shoot trap and mount my gun on the same part of my shoulder every time I mount my gun and then bring my head down onto the stock, how can raising the comb have any effect on the angle of my gun?
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That statement is not actually 100% correct, raising or lowering the comb changes the point of AIM from the shooters perspective, if you raise the comb and put the bead on a target you may miss it by shooting over the top, this is due to the sight picture and point of AIM. So in this case the gun would shoot high only because of the POA and sight picture down the rib, in order to change point of IMPACT you need to look at pitch.

A change in pitch can require a change in the comb AND a change in the LOP but not in every case, it is a little tricky getting your head round all the possible elements like drop, comb, LOP, pitch, cast etc which is why I seriously recommend that book if you want to learn more....

 
no.1topdog said:
I will agree with you Nicola on your last post here.

However, the point I was trying to put across was that there are several very good shooters who coudn't teach anyone to tie up their shoelaces, but would go out and win a competition at the drop of a hat. A good shooter does not always equal a good coach because of this alone.

A good coach will teach you to shoot well, but I am perfectly in agreement that you need a "special" coach to take you across that line into winning championships, and that coach would have to know what that takes themselves.

I've just seen so many people paying for coaching from a known shooter to be told "you're behind it mate" ££££££Kerrrrchinggggg! And it annoys me no end. :biggrin:
Click to expand...
Correct.

That is why we have said this many times before on other threads. You can be a reasonable coach even if you are not a good shot now (they may have got old like me...and can't keep their end up anymore against the young bloods). You may also be a great shot and a crap coach.

But for people who want to 'WIN' at international level.....then you need an expert in your field who will be or was.....winning in your discipline. The very best of these coaches tend to retire from high level competition in order to coach their protégées ......true story..!

 
jwpzx9r said:
Generally speaking; raising the comb, lowers the back of the gun...which points the barrels up at more of an angle...which means you will see more rib and the gun will tend to shoot higher.

skeet

I am mystified at this statement can you tell me how raising the comb of a shotgun does this? I shoot trap and mount my gun on the same part of my shoulder every time I mount my gun and then bring my head down onto the stock, how can raising the comb have any effect on the angle of my gun?
Click to expand...

Well think about it for a minute.  Something has to give doesn't it?

If you are a sporting shooter and mount the gun to your face, then back to your shoulder...then your face denotes where the top of the top of the gun stops. If I were to then loosen an adjustable comb, while the gun was mounted, with the muzzles fixed on a specific POA...then the butt of the gun will drop down, so the barrels will point further up.

Look at this image.  Imagine the STRAIGHT line A-D shows POA and initial POI.  Then you raise the comb.  The STRAIGHT line A-D still shows POA but now, the DIAGONAL line A-D shows the new POI.

The Gun rotates downwards around the muzzles/bead at B.

POIwithmathsmall.jpg


However.  A trap shooter, who mounts the butt to the shoulder first, then lowers the head to the gun, will have to lower their head less, having raised the comb, and the eye will be higher above the rib.  So the same visual effect of seeing more rib, but with the Trap shooter, it is the rear sight that has moved UP, so the above image would be inverted.

This assumes that you genuinely have mounted the butt of the gun in the exact same place and brought your head down to the gun.  when I shot target rifles (only mentioned due to the adjustment factor), my gun had a hook on the back that was brought under the arm pit.  So once that was in place, adjusting the comb would move the head up and down, rather than the gun.

 
Stop talking pish!!! A high comb does not push the butt down out of the shoulder pocket (unless you are a freak or imbecile) a high comb lifts your eye above the rib,(like raising the rear sight on a target rifle) gun stays in the shoulder pocket, point of aim is changed, makes the guns point of impact higher than the guns point of aim...in general terms, broadly.

 
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Darkside said:
Stop talking pish!!! A high comb does not push the butt down out of the shoulder pocket (unless you are a freak or imbisile) a high comb lifts your eye above the rib,(like raising the rear sight on a target rifle) gun stays in the shoulder pocket, point of aim is changed, makes the guns point of impact higher than the guns point of aim...in general terms, broadly.
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Imbecile

Not for a trap shooter (as you are I believe, mainly?), no that's right. Or more accurately, not for someone who mounts the butt first then brings the head down.

As I said, for a pre-mounted gun, the image above can be inverted (turned upside down) and the diagonal line would becomes the

change in POA rather than the change in POI.  ie. where you are looking has changed, but the gun is still pointing in the same place. 

But, if a sporting shooter mounts to the cheek, then back to the shoulder and I raise the comb on his gun, and he does the same again...he will see more rib and the barrels will be pointing up at more of an angle.

It is maths and it is there, in front of you.

 
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Skeet UK said:
Imbecile

Not for a trap shooter, no. Or more accurately, not for someone who mounts the butt first then brings the head down.

But, if a sporting shooter mounts to the cheek, then back to the shoulder and I raise the comb on his gun, and he does the same again...he will see more rib and the barrels will be pointing up at more of an angle.

It is maths and it is there, in front of you.
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This makes sense to me.

But to put it succinctly see my earlier post. Anything that effects the height of the eye above the rib will effect poi. End of.

 
Let's throw the cat among the pidgeon's....what happens if you move the comb left or right? I have heard one person say move the comb left if you want the gun to shoot more left and move the comb right to shoot more right and I have heard the opposite said? which is right. I personally think the first one as by moving the comb left you now have more wood in between your cheek and the main stock so this will naturally kick the gun left.....

 
HankBomb said:
Let's throw the cat among the pidgeon's....what happens if you move the comb left or right? I have heard one person say move the comb left if you want the gun to shoot more left and move the comb right to shoot more right and I have heard the opposite said? which is right. I personally think the first one as by moving the comb left you now have more wood in between your cheek and the main stock so this will naturally kick the gun left.....
Click to expand...
You are correct my friend moving the comb left will shift POI to the left.

 
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