we must have someone

[schmokinn]

we must have someone whos is more suitably qualified than myself to start a government petition.

if there is not i will do it but i really feel someone more experienced in writing this sort of thing would do better.

has to be a certainty to get 50,000 sigs and get it discussed in the house there must be getting close to a million shooters that this may affect!

http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/

lets do something positive...any takers?

 

[Les]

Petition about what, exactly? :dontknow:

 

[schmokinn]

sorry i should have made it clear.

the unreasonable planning demands and noise complaints against shooting venues which at the moment are heading in the direction of ruining our sport..

there are grounds coming under threat on an almost weekly basis and we need to fight against this...to protect our rights and the rights of venue owners/proprietors

there already ones reference motorsports and music venues talking of people signing waivers and exemptions for established businesses.

i tried to put something together last night but realised that there must be someone much better qualified to word this.

or should we just sit back and watch the demise of our sport,pastime and livelyhood?

the main reason i am suggesting someone more qualified should do this is when you start to register it asks you to search for similar as presumably they will not accept multiple petitions on the same subject and also i did not want to dilute the response.

approx 1.5 million shotguns held by approximately 750,000 shotgun certificate holders....surely if we get together we can do something.

i guess in some areas people will say they don't have a problem but it is spreading like a cancer through the country and we need to make every effort to stop it now!

 

[Salopian]

Get the CPSA to do something.

 

[schmokinn]

Get the CPSA to do something.

just looked out the window and there is a whole squadron of those pink things coming in to land!

apathy will get us nowhere,i appreciate you feel it is there responsibility and so do i but on past record their isn't much chance is there?

 

[Bryn12]

I don't think it's just relevant to shooting, think farming, motor(bike) racing...........all are under threat to nimbies [SIZE=14.3999996185303px]who have moved into an area [/SIZE]and those with an axe to grind. Where there is long established usage then the complainers should be told to 'do one'.  The main culprits are retired old farts who have sold up in cities 'burbs, bought their rural 'shangri la' and want to make it just like the place they've just left.  They have plenty of time to spend on committees so end up on the community councils making a damned nuisance of themselves. The other PITAs are the terminally idle who also end up on the community councils or carrying out the wishes of the above as self appointed watchmen community.

 

[RichW1234]

If a Club or Ground is affiliated to the CPSA then they are included in a Club Legal Expense Scheme which offers free legal advice in the event of noise complaints, landlord disputes etc. If the grounds activities are then suspended or revoked it will take on the costs to go to court (subject to an insurance excess) up to £100,000 per claim. The key is the ground must be affiliated with the CPSA at the point of complaint as the insurance is not retrospective!  

 

[ExSCA]

Rich - that's good info, can you tell us if this has been successfully used in any cases? 

 

[schmokinn]

yes all very nice but not all grounds are cpsa affiliated so does that mean we can afford to lose them..i think not.

that aside sitting on our arses doing nothing until there is a problem when it is already to late is not advancing our cause in any way.

what we need is some kind of change in the law/statutes that deters these people from trying to get places shut down or stopped opening in the first place.

is there no positivity on this forum at all

145 veiws 2 replies...does nobody care?

 

[schmokinn]

If a Club or Ground is affiliated to the CPSA then they are included in a Club Legal Expense Scheme which offers free legal advice in the event of noise complaints, landlord disputes etc. If the grounds activities are then suspended or revoked it will take on the costs to go to court (subject to an insurance excess) up to £100,000 per claim. The key is the ground must be affiliated with the CPSA at the point of complaint as the insurance is not retrospective!  

i don't know that Purbeck has had any help from the cpsa.i may be wrong but i beleive it has been privately funded by individuals and events.

 

[schmokinn]

ok so io have just read the "keywords" of the cpsa legal insurance policy and it does not say it covers for planning disputes,noise abatement orders or any suchlike thing...bit of a chocolate teapot from that point of veiw!

https://www.cpsa.co.uk/userfiles/file/CPSALegalExpensesInsurancePolicySummary.pdf

 

[schmokinn]

the thing is i would quite happily do it but i am absolutely positive there would be criticism of what i put due to lack of experience/knowledge of these matters.

it has to be under a 1000 words so could not possily take a huge amount of effort could it? its free to do.

surely someone has the time and inclination?

 

[RichW1234]

Noise complaints comes under the protection of licences (point 5) but I'm not sure it includes planning disputes. I'll see if I can find out...

 

[schmokinn]

Noise complaints comes under the protection of licences (point 5) but I'm not sure it includes planning disputes. I'll see if I can find out...

could you expand on that for me as you do not need a licence to run a shoot/shooting ground.

i read it as protecting your gun licence or rfd licence.

but this is getting away from the point of the post.i am trying to generate a pro active culture to this not reactive.

we all know that the chances of a ground reopening after being forced to close is about as likely as iceberg in Dubai.

i feel the way it is going if we do not do something now we will end up with nothing to do something with.

 

[Salopian]

The CPSA used to have (still do???) a consultancy who would guide you and investigate noise complaints.

 

[schmokinn]

ok this is my rough draft for the government e-petition

"There are almost weekly cases of people knowingly moving within proximity of clay shooting venues, only to try to have their planning revoked,impossible noise reduction measures introduced or have them closed completely when they take exception to the noise.
also we are seeing a large amount of complaints from people who have lived in the area of clay shooting venues for years but for various reasons suddenly decide they do not want it there anymore.
we are suffering an onslaught and being persecuted by people who have no understanding of shooting or why people wish to pursue their right to do so.
there is a large amount of people that are scared of guns for no good reason that will also do anything to prevent them being anywhere near them.
the danger to anyone not involved in clay shooting from it is non existent.
 
It is extremely detrimental to the UK's shooting industryat all levels, when all the clay shooting venues start disappearing. clay shooting as a British tradition,sport and pastime will do also
we have European,World and Olympic champions they sometimes start from an early age and improve over time with practice and training,this has to happen somewhere.
 
as an industry shooting overall is worth approximately 2 billion to the British economy and clay shooting is a large part of this with hundreds of thousands of regular shooters at the moment it is growing but with the way things are heading it will hit a brick wall as there will be nowhere to shoot.
 
locals should not be able to complain about established venues as the mood takes them unless it can be proved that there is a serious increase in noise levels,anyone who wishes to buy or rent a property within a determined distance of a clay shooting venue should have to read and sign legislature that waives their right to complain about the noise from the nearby venue. If they do not wish to be bothered by something that was a fixture of the community long before they arrived, they should not move there in the first place.."
 
would anybody like to comment on what should be added/removed or any other constructive suggestions or further aims aims sure it can be improved/finessed

 

[Nimbusgb]

I think starting yet another single sport petition is counter productive.

If more sports supported the 'agent of change' movement we'd be able to get a basic principle at least discussed and rhe numbers would be far more convncing.

https://www.change.org/p/sajid-javid-mp-adopt-the-agent-of-change-principle

Perhaps statements of support from motor racing, shooting and other movements could be added to the original agent of change statement.

It's worth considering the approach as well, you have to be careful not to make it impossible to ever change anything but I agree that the current ability of a single complainant to make operation all but impossible is unrealistic.

 

[RobertBeard]

All the National Bodies for Motor Racing and Shooting and any other affected concerns should support the above and exhort all their members and supports to sign the petition as suggested by Nimbus GB.  This would include all rural organisations and even Campanologists!

 

[winchester73]

we must have someone whos is more suitably qualified than myself to start a government petition.

if there is not i will do it but i really feel someone more experienced in writing this sort of thing would do better.

has to be a certainty to get 50,000 sigs and get it discussed in the house there must be getting close to a million shooters that this may affect!

http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/

lets do something positive...any takers?

Forgive my ignorance, what has prompted this thread? A particular ground/s?