Police woman shot in Leeds

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jwpzx9r said:
Robert although nothing to do with shooting or the thread leaving the EU would be a very grave mistake for the people of the UK. The EU debate is mainly populated by racist  xenophobic fantasists who still think that the UK (or in their minds Great Britain!) is still a great industrial nation with an empire to plunder...wrong!

Again nothing to do with the thread or EU for that matter but a indication of how far the UK has slipped would be gauged by this thought on the eve of the centenary of the Great War how many men from the former empire nations do you think this county would we have volunteering to fight for King and country if the same were to happen in 2014... not too many is my gu
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Do some research and I think you will find for such a tiny little island we are still without a doubt GREAT. :nyam:

 
Salopian said:
I am reliably informed that various Governments have carried out opinion polls on bringing back the death penalty but it is overwhelmingly rejected.
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Wouldn't matter whether every person in the country, as a result of an opinion poll, were in favour of bring it back: the number of EU treaties we've signed means that, since 1994, when the 'setting fire to His/Her Majesty's shipyards, piracy on the high seas, endangering the life of the monarch and treason in a time of war' etc. statues were finally binned, we cannot reintroduce the death penalty. Indeed, realistically and pragmatically, to do so would require us to rip-up those treaties, which would mean us leaving the EU - and that's not going to happen, as they're our largest trading partner, and we're not going to piss them off purely over the knee-jerk reaction of a bunch of single-issue one-trick-pony merchants.

 
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"Lastly, capital punishment has proven, over several centuries, not to be a deterrent: the proof's in the evidence - if it were, then people wouldn't murder other people any more, would they? And yet they continue to do so, especially in those countries where capital punishment is still on the statute books."

Who GAF?  No society needs the disruption or the economic drag of those convicted.  My suggestion is that they be leased for medical research and/or sold to the pet food industry.  Give them the opportunity to actually contribute to the society at large.

 
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BOSTONMICK 1 said:
another sad part to this story is that the public when they listen to the reports or read the newspaper account of the incident will not hear or see the words sawn off and will only hear shotgun.as with all these incidents the legal shooters will be tarred with the same brush as yet another criminal.
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'tis true: more people are killed in the UK each year as a result of domestic accidents (à la falling in the bath) than through being shot with a firearm. Problem is, falling the bath, or hitting your head on the kerb whilst pissed, isn't very sexy in terms of headlines.

 
Wonko the Sane said:
"Lastly, capital punishment has proven, over several centuries, not to be a deterrent: the proof's in the evidence - if it were, then people wouldn't murder other people any more, would they? And yet they continue to do so, especially in those countries where capital punishment is still on the statute books."

Who GAF?  No society needs the disruption or the economic drag of those convicted.  My suggestion is that they be leased for medical experimentation and/or sold to the pet food industry.  Give them the opportunity to actually contribute to the society at large.
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Joking aside Wonk - there spaketh a man from the country with the highest proportion, per capita, in the world of its citizens in clink and subsequent re-offending rate..

And a nation which executes people whom, the evidence later proves, to have been innocent. So be fair, Wonko old son, you'll forgive me if we don't take the US as any form of model in this regard. You're bested only by one country in both numbers of incarcerations and executions: China (what with their stellar human rights record an all), with Iran coming in a less than coy 3rd. Are you sure this is the company you want to keep mate?

 
LS&B - no argument from me on the numbers and no joking.  We also have a considerable number of moronic laws that exacerbate the situation.   And a social climate that has lost considerable contact with reality (much like where you are, BTW).  My suggestion for murderers was totally serious.  Who needs them?  Well, medical research and the pet food people.

IMHO all of that has pushed us, you too even before us, into an overall situation that is beyond resolve.  For a local view on that I'd refer you to "A Clockwork Orange".  Not exactly prophetic but a fair summation.  Oh, wait!!!  You can't read that book - it's been banned by your government.  Obviously you're not capable of dealing with such a topic.

I'm sure you'll agree, prolly for different reasons, this is wasting more bandwidth than it deserves

peace and love

 
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Wonko the Sane said:
LS&B - no argument from me on the numbers and no joking.  We also have a considerable number of moronic laws that exacerbate the situation.   And a social climate that has lost considerable contact with reality (much like where you are, BTW).  My suggestion for murderers was totally serious.  Who needs them?  Well, medical research and the pet food people.

IMHO all of that has pushed us, you too even before us, into an overall situation that is beyond resolve.  For a local view on that I'd refer you to "A Clockwork Orange".  Not exactly prophetic but a fair summation. 

I'm sure you'll agree, prolly for different reasons, this is wasting more bandwidth than it deserves

peace and love
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Roger that my friend. :)  Although my reasons are pretty straight forward: I try never to mix metaphors or my allegorical literature with reality.

Likewise, sincerely - peace and love mate.

 
" I try never to mix metaphors or my allegorical literature with reality."

Now THAT is really funny!  Those pesky allegories!!!!

 
If that book has been banned I wonder why it is one of the books my daughter is studying for A level English Literature.

 
Hah - the irony...

A Clockwork Orange - to give the book its correct title was never banned in the UK - it was however banned in the US, removed from libraries in Colorado and then Massachusetts. 

The FILM wasn't banned in the UK either. It was withdrawn by Warner Brothers on the request of Stanley Kubrick (after it was connected to the death of a vagrant in Buckinhgamshire). It became available on VHS and DVD when Kubrick died... although I have a 1980's semi-official release on VHS.  In the US the film was rated 'C for condemned' by Catholic Bishops which BANNED Catholics from seeing it. 

(massive Kubrick fan) 

 
Macc Ladd said:
that is old hat!!! These days with forensics etc!!!! We need a deterent, and with nothing in place, people take more chances.
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And you're naïve enough to think that the police are never corrupt and never fit anyone up for something they haven't done.  Oh dear...

 
Wonko the Sane said:
...  For a local view on that I'd refer you to "A Clockwork Orange".  Not exactly prophetic but a fair summation.  Oh, wait!!!  You can't read that book - it's been banned by your government.  Obviously you're not capable of dealing with such a topic.
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You edited this after I'd originally replied, so in the interests of accuracy, the book has never been banned here in the UK - whereas, both the book and film have been banned and/or censored (and in one case a book-seller arrested) in the US, as a result of neat puritan prurience. Indeed, neither has the film ever been banned here in the UK - rather it was its director, Stanley Kubric, who voluntarily withdrew it from release after receiving unfavourable reviews and amid claims of copycat violence.

 
Not to nit pick but the edit was done prior to your reply.

I'd heard some time ago that the book had been banned in GB so I gave it a check and the site I drew from listed the book as banned.  Mea culpa.   never bothered to check the film since porno runs everywhere I presumed violence could too.  BTW, the film is amazing in so many ways, but one being that the book is nearly the shooting script.  Probably the least molested transition in the history of film.

You wouldn't believe the hold the puritans still have on the US.  the ultra right Xtians are as bad as Muslims.  Splattered brains and bodies are plenty OK but a naked nipple !>!>!>!>!>!  and Huck Fin is on the chopping block too I hear.  Those people easily qualify as research associates and pet food too.  

but that all doesn't change my contention that creatures who cross the boundaries of the social contract so grossly have no place in that society nor should that society feel any responsibility in maintaining them.

JMO of course

 
I watched clock work orange many years ago, what a complete load of tosh.

 
Wonko the Sane said:
Not to nit pick but the edit was done prior to your reply.

I'd heard some time ago that the book had been banned in GB so I gave it a check and the site I drew from listed the book as banned.  Mea culpa.   never bothered to check the film since porno runs everywhere I presumed violence could too.  BTW, the film is amazing in so many ways, but one being that the book is nearly the shooting script.  Probably the least molested transition in the history of film.

You wouldn't believe the hold the puritans still have on the US.  the ultra right Xtians are as bad as Muslims.  Splattered brains and bodies are plenty OK but a naked nipple !>!>!>!>!>!  and Huck Fin is on the chopping block too I hear.  Those people easily qualify as research associates and pet food too.  

but that all doesn't change my contention that creatures who cross the boundaries of the social contract so grossly have no place in that society nor should that society feel any responsibility in maintaining them.

JMO of course
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Again, in the interests of accuracy, if you look at post #26, you'll see that I block-posted everything you'd written at that time in order to reply to it - the bit about banning was not present at that time. Not that it matters, you make some good points above about the state of what gets banned in the US and by whom. Just one reason I no longer live and work there (which I did for a while in the 90s). Colonel Kurtz, in Apocalypse Now, makes much the same point: [paraphrasing] "we can bomb people to bits, but we can't write 'fcuk' on the bomb that does it".

Yeah, I heard that about Huck Finn - I suspect it's the same group who wanted the word 'nigger' expunged from Webster's Dictionary - rather a Stalinesque approach to airbrushing history, what?

As for those in prison, I take a less Protestant (i.e.retributory) view on them, in that prison is where you're sent as punishment, not to be punished.

 
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ips said:
I watched clock work orange many years ago, what a complete load of tosh.
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Let's just say it hasn't dated well. Also, Anthony Burgess, its author, said it was a book he wishes he'd never written (he wrote it in just three weeks) and was so badly [in his view] misinterpreted as to have no value as art. Mind you, given its linguistic jiggery-pokery, like Sian's daughter, I'd have much rather have read it at school than the drivel that is James Joyce's 'Ulysses'. Call me a peasant. 

 
I thought the whole thing was ridiculous and the acting as bad as the story line.

apocalypse now well that is my favourite film of all time and to use your sentiment it dates very well indeed as imo it could have been written / produced last week.

Never get off the boat,

i bet he wished he hadn't :)

 
And of course ... The Doors... This is the end my only friend ...the end! BRILLIANT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 
Yes, a truly brilliant film fantastic story top draw acting great round track. I have a directors cut double dvd one disc is about the making of the film with out takes and interviews etc. Apparently much of it was add lib. Even the cave scene / monologue was partly ad lib.

Most favourite dialogue was from the very very cool captain.

I love the smell of napalm in the morning etc. Brilliant.

 
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