Caesar Guerini steel quality

I used a CG at our club recently and was very impressed, however one member commented that the steel was not as good as Browning or Beretta.

Any objective evidence for this, what are others experience or opinions please?

imho complete bull

GeordieTrapper said:

I used a CG at our club recently and was very impressed, however one member commented that the steel was not as good as Browning or Beretta.

Any objective evidence for this, what are others experience or opinions please?

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Have owned all 3 the CG is far superior in build quality, handling and reliability 

Nothing objective to offer but, having had 1 Miroku, 3 Berettas and now a CG, I'd put money on  CG's steel being at least as good as Beretta's standard Excelsior HSA. Bearing in mind of course that Steelium is not a material, merely a marketing buzz word probably referring to their cold forging process which churns out barrels more cheaply.

Mirokus & Brownings seem more prone to rust than the Italian guns but no one doubts the quality of their steel either.

I think steelium in Beretta's term just means lighter barrels

I don't think there's been any doubt about steel quality of CG or any other make to be honest. 

There is just good action designs and adequate. All are capable of dealing witth the amount of use most people subject them to.

GeordieTrapper said:

I used a CG at our club recently and was very impressed,

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It is quite noticeable that a lot of CG owners stick with them long term and if they trade up, often as not it's to another CG.

But there's no need for owners of the more traditional guns to knock other makes because choice is a good thing as is open mindedness. I wasn't a fan of CGs but after trying a few out I sold my last Beretta and joined the movement. No regrets whatsoever!

Many years ago when CG started to show around the grounds I asked the opinion of a gunsmith he said he had taken one to pieces when offered a dealership he was impressed and took a dealership on .I bought a Maxum on the strength of this knowing and trusting the guy I have not been disappointed by the quality or performance.

ColinD said:

I think steelium in Beretta's term just means lighter barrels

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Ooooh, i thought it was Italian for 'take your money'

I doubt you could put a cigarette paper between the quality or material strength of any of the top dozen makes of guns never mind those mentioned. 

Incidentally the CG steel is said to be good enough for a million rounds on at least one of their models !  

I’m curious to know on what basis such a claim was made.

If Aluminium actions are adequate, then the lowest grade of steel is going to be at very least on par. In basic material raw terms at least.

I know the grade of steel used of just one english gun. 722M24 (EN40B in old money) It’s a chromium-molybdenum nitriding steel which has high resistance to shock and wear. This steel has been used widely in motorsport for crankshafts and industrial impact tools.it can be hardened to around 55 Rockwell C scale. Strength around 1100 MPa.

 I imagine there will be some variation across manufacturers whose design engineers made their own individual choices. EN24V nickel chromium steel is a reasonable candidate and I think I’ve heard this steel mentioned as being used by some gun makers. Again, used for race car engine connecting rods. Has a tensile strength of around 900MPa

The strongest 7068 precipitation hardened aluminium alloy with a tensile strength in excess of 700MPa isn’t especially hard, but could be given some wear resistance by hard anodising or other surface treatments such as DLC coating.
 

my hunch is the comment was sour grapes

The CG barrels are made by fabarm, if they can make a 3 1/2" super magnum sxs I think you can trust your CG barrels not to be inferior 

Lloyd said:

my hunch is the comment was sour grapes

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That or hearsay from the trade. Many gunsmiths and old school dealers believed for years that CGs were blinged up budget guns selling at Beretta/Browning prices. I remember one elderly gunsmith saying they weren't properly built because they used roll pins to locate the action parts and the ejectors were all wrong. Quote: "When the ejectors go wrong, AND THEY WILL, don't bring it me to be".

Talking of ejectors going wrong, any SV10, 692/690 owners out there? Any CG owners out there had ejector problems? Oh, and my CG does not have roll pins anywhere, unlike my last Beretta which had several...

@Westward  Could it be that CG made modifications/improvements over the years?

Trouble is we are all protective of the brands we use, anything else is never as good else I'd have one

Lloyd said:

@Westward  Could it be that CG made modifications/improvements over the years?

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All guns probably get modified over the years, mostly to improve them. Except that is Beretta with the 690's

So good they branded the improved ones 694's to distance themselfs from the previous ones (no offense intended)

Being the nerd that I am, this subject refused to depart from my noggin. So, to quench my curiosity I did some digging around, eventually leading to looking  up the NATO small arms specifications and cross referencing to BS EN steel grades with similar composition. Lo and behold, the “NATO steel” is basically the same chrome molybdenum vanadium martensitic nitriding grade 722M24 as noted above and in addition to the English gun maker that uses said grade, I now know of one other German brand that uses this similar “NATO approved steel for  small arms” in their own gun manufacturer.

Goodness... no wonder people fall asleep in my company!

Sounds like the comments are those of a bar room bore to me. Some people just repeat what they've heard because they can't think for themselves.

I've owned 3 CG's and the only fault I would point out is the coating they cover the actions with (can't recall what it's called or even if they still use it) It will wear after many years of use, so I just smear a little silcone finish over it from time to time (same as I would with any other gun) 

I've nothing against Beretta or Browning, I have had two of each of them in the past. My Maxum is 12 years old and is still in excellent order. If I were to renew, I'd not discount going for another brand, but I can't see a single good reason not to stick with CG at the moment. By far and away the best gun I have ever owned and (gun related) product back up service I have ever encountered. 

I have just sold my 'mint' condition 725 Black, you'll know the one, it was er.........and I quote "It was rusty when it came out of the box" "All the black wears off in the first week of ownership"  "The firing pins will corrode away inside a month"  " You will get constant misfires due to the angle of the firing pins".......etc.,   etc., etc.  Well, I am happy to say that I experienced NONE of the aforementioned. I have just sold the gun privately and it's new owner could not believe it had been used at least once, sometimes twice a week, for 4 years.  It was complete with all (+2 extra) the chokes, triggers, allen keys and paperwork. I may live to regret selling it, but it is a means to an end. I have to say that it was carried around the various grounds in a slip, (not worn around my neck !) came out, went bang bang bang, then it went back into the slip. It was cleaned as soon as I got home (or at the ground if it was wet), the stock was oiled once a month and the gun was never left out in the middle of my lawn overnight (to help stop all of the rusting issues). It was always (like all of my guns) stored in a silicone sock. The result being, I did NOT lose a lot of money when I sold it. The new owner has what is,  virtually a new gun.  Oh and the final point, I do NOT buy overly priced 'gun cleaning products' that I can not live without (I prefer to live without them). GT85, 3 in 1 oil and car engine oil (Castrol GTX) on the exterior metal work seem to have worked for me. So, do NOT believe all the horror stories that you will hear about any gun, most are just myths.