Cartridge advise

I am going to sound like a novice now because of the question I am going to ask you learned folk, but trust me I am not.I used to shoot loads years ago but had to stop shooting clays because of raising a young family, apart from shooting a few straw balers every year. Pigeon shooting was my main game and I have been a professional guide in the past.When I stopped competitive clays Express cartridges were the fastest yet softest recoil cartridge on the market, I think it was due to the Vectan powder they used back then. I have used the budget express cartridges fairly recently and thought the recoil was a bit harsh.I am a fairly big bloke and recoil doesn't bother me much but I still think the less recoil the better , but I would not want to compromise kill quality in favour of less recoil too much.I am obviously going to have to do alot of research myself but I was hoping you ' guys n gels ' could cut a few corners for me.As price should no longer be such an issue I would like to hear your advise on any make.I want to know the best fibre wad cartridges  in relation to recoil, and the best plaswad loads in your individual opinions .I am thinking of trying Express World Cup in both plaswad and fibre first. Waiting advise with eager anticipation. Happy Trigger

There are many more people on here that can comment.However IMO the softest on the shoulder I have found when using an OU were Hull Comp X, great value and work well.Gamebore White GoldBlue Diamond are also nice due to the Gordon recoil system in them and very clean.Most of the other low end ones I have tried; even through my auto are a bit kicky, Nobel Sport being the worst.Jon.

Thanks for that.

In plastic wad (I hate fibre with a passion) World Cups are a no no in recoil terms, they are a good shell but way too punchy and way too expensive, in short there are many many more sound choices out there.The Express Supers are still one of the very best in terms of recoil and no compromise on speed but again around £40+ per thou dearer than the Eley Superbs which I would put money on being AT LEAST as good in every way.It may surprise you but shell choice often comes down to geographical access to distributors!! Down my way you simply cannot get all these Clever, RC, Victory malarky; I`m sure something within their ranges would be perfectly good. The thing to remember is the dearest is always the one with the deepest brass and looks more expensive on the outside but it will never break anything you shoot too far in front of.The other thing to remember is shot sizes, basically English shells loaded here contain what is printed on the box, continental stuff almost always is half a shot size bigger. So if you want 7.5`s make sure you buy 8`s.A simple rule of thumb is to choose the mid range offering from whatever make is available to you locally. Personally I would not shoot fibre unless I absolutely had to and remember like for like they do recoil more than plastic.Try and find a supplier who sells home brews called Proper Cartridges, these are modelled on the Hull Sovereigns and are extremely good but cost around £90 per thou less /wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-wink.gif, proving there really is such a thing as daylight robbery/white collar crime/organised cartels.

I've shot White Diamond before - didn't get on with them, although my shooting is inconsistent enough that it may have been the issue.I found Fiocchi Super Sporter very light on my shoulder...

Im with Hammy on the fibres; me and my gun hate them and they are the reason I steered clear of game fairs for years (that and the guys with 6 cards desperately going round trying to beat your score).Any 24/28g plaswd will break any clay you are likely to see on a sporting course nowadays, pick one that you are comfy with. I shoot Pro Ones but a couple years back shot a 98 with Hull Chevron (remember them?) low recoil shells that had been in my cupbord for years.For 1000 World Cup you can probably get 1300 better value shells with the same outcome for the clays and less of a sore head at the end of it. There is not and never has been a shell that will make you hit more clays, just very good marketing. Ignore all the guff about speed; you or I will never know any better and nor will the birds! Enjoy!! Ed

I use Express High Velocity 24gm 7 1/2 in both plastic and fibre wads. The ballistics, to me, seem similar from both of them. They are nice to shoot using my 391, but I don't like firing a lot of them through an O/U, I just do not like recoil at all. Gamebore XLR in both plastic and fibre are ok too.

Hull Sovereigns are a prime example. I love them, I used them on my return to shooting FITASC at Lakenheath. I amazed myself shooting a 95/100 with them to come equal first, great kills but they are a bit punchy.I havent tried them in fibres though.Express Supers do appeal to me, if they are like they used to be. Thanks for the input so far.

I'm currently using 28gram Eley Olympics 7.5 (plastic wads), they are comfy to shoot IMO and break targets well if the shot is in the right place /wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-wink.gif  Rob

There is SOOOO much suposition so far!/wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-surprised.gif NOBODY has actualy tested on paper what their favorite load will do at distance! I never assume something is good because my breaks are good that day. I test my load and choke combinations usualy at a measure 40 yards. If it works there, it will work at ALL distances.When I travel to Europe or Africa, cartridge choice is limited. I try a box of what is available, for recoil first. I open the cartridge to check the components. Is the lead round and uniform? I also use my pocket knife to check for relative hardness. Did the shot cup cover all the pellets? Is the wad straight or is it deformed when the shell is assembled?Here are a few Euro cartridges that have good patterns in my DT10L:Gamebore White Gold (the ones George uses!)RC 4RC RedRC Red Supernik (best patterns at 35M!!!!)Hull SouvereignBorgnani Sporting and trapMany of the other big names, just sucked. One famous Italian had holes that you could throw a shoe through! Here in NA, we don't look at fancy brass, we pattern, pattern and pattern! Also, supersonic loads loos speed at twice the rate of subsonic loads. At 40 plus yards, there is not much difference and at 60 there is NONE! Pellet density is better than more antimony! The Lone Canadian,Henry/wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-wink.gif

hnachaj said:

Also, supersonic loads loos speed at twice the rate of subsonic loads. At 40 plus yards, there is not much difference and at 60 there is NONE! Pellet density is better than more antimony! The Lone Canadian,Henry/wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-wink.gif/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

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Don`t know about none Henry, the slow stuff is about a yard behind and 10" low at least /wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-laugh.gif/wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-laugh.gif/wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-laugh.gif/wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-wink.gif.

Actualy, it is a few inches!!!!!!!!!!/wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-cool.gif At 30 yards!!!!!!!!!!/wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-confused.gif I love the ones that tell the others: 3 feet in front and two under! NUMBNUTS, if I can measure that at 40 yards, I would be a genius! No need for the tape measure at 10 feet to measure a firebook from a boiler! The Lone Canadian,Henry/wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-wink.gif

/wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-laugh.gif/wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-laugh.gif Inches is probably right on paper Henry, but in practice I find it detectable (not the under bit) which is why I don`t do slow. Having said that I don`t do hyper either/wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-frown.gif, never seem to do well with the likes of Sonics, there definately is a point of diminishing returns with shells and speed.

))))))))))))))I am with Henry. Pattern. Pattern, Pattern. And you need to know what it does at altitude ! (if you shoot internationally). )))))))Paper cases always a joy, when I can get them!

Never shot at a pattern plate in my life! Didn't do me too bad! If I shoot different shells I think I can make a pretty good judgement on the kills and variations of targets I shoot with them with the experience I have. or maybe this is the difference between my being good and very good! Mmmmmm I doubt it! Glen.

I`ve done a fair whack of patterning in my yoof and can`t deny it can be very useful in ways you hadn`t considered. POI for one and knowing for sure that when you slip in the Cylinder choke it really will double your kill zone for those close rabbits. /wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-wink.gif It can also have a massive negative affect if you`re not careful, try visualising the appearance of even a tight pattern at extended ranges where there are inevitably loads of gaps and it can play mind games with your whole temperament. I find it best to forget those particular imprints, instead trying to remember what Glen is talking about, solid breaks when you do your bit /wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-wink.gif. Contrary to the fashionable statements regarding huge variance between pattern spreads with the same load, I have always found the opposite. I`m not saying it is not possible (or even probable) that you get a half out of a 1/4, just that chokes tend to throw bloody well close to what they`re meant to. Unless you get scenarios such as a bad batch of Optimas that had the wrong colour rubber bands fitted. That is poor manufacturing practice, not flawed patterns. I always found that each and every choke threw more or less open than it`s stablemate according to the notches, never counted holes but the diameter appearance was good enough for me./wp-content/forum-smileys/sf-cool.gif

For sporting I think Eley Olympic 8's as best value for performance, price (£158 a 1000 in Lincs) they are also a comfrtable shell to shoot. For edge on long distance Eley Superb 71/2 but more expensive.Stewart

Stewart.... where do you buy from in Lincs - I never thought of that, if prices are cheaper than the South East, i could pick up lead when I visit my Mum  I know Derek Lee in Tumby and Forest Lodge Guns in Wragby

shootclay admin said:

Stewart.... where do you buy from in Lincs - I never thought of that, if prices are cheaper than the South East, i could pick up lead when I visit my Mum  I know Derek Lee in Tumby and Forest Lodge Guns in Wragby

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 Hi Matt,The last lot I bought were from Derek Lee, he normally has cartridge prices listed on his web site so you could check first.