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El Spavo

Matched chokes... what is blue metal??

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El Spavo

Does anyone know enough about chokes to know if I was to get a second pair of Mod and/or Imp Cyl Invector Plus chokes for my B525 so I could have the same in both barrels, is there only one type/make of choke that will look the same as the one that my gun came with? Only asking as I can't find one sole source of info which suggests 'yes, you buy this type which is direct from Browning so it'll exactly match your existing and there are no others available' cos there seems to be a bit of choice out there (keep seeing the name Briley crop up?) I wouldn't want chrome coloured ones, which seem the easier type to get, rather one that matched the existing, so I read about blue chokes (I know about the blue black colour coming from the processed protection) which actually look black but if I was to get what is classed as a blue colour choke, would it be the same as I alreday have or different depending on where it came from? Hope that makes sense... didn't think it would be this hard just getting a second copy of what I have?! :)

(Yes, I know it's all in the head, just be nice to start off with a matching pair so I DON'T have that thing in my head wondering if it's me or I simply picked the wrong chamber on the selector... top or bottom makes no difference if they're the same, and loads of people on here seem to pair up 1/2 & 1/2 or 3/8 & 3/8, etc. anyway)

p.s. From what I can make out, I believe, and that's a stretch, that the Browning model code for them is 1130773 & 1130783, but I'm definitely not putting the mortgage on that being correct! ūüėĄ

Edited by El Spavo
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MartynB

The nearest colour match you will get for a ¬†choke will indeed be from Browning . I think the reason that many ¬†after market chokes¬†are stainless ¬†steel ¬†is just that there are so many variations of ‚Äú bluing or blacking ‚Äú on guns¬†both in colour and technique that it probably makes sense for an after market¬†manufacturer to just have one ¬†contrasting¬†finish rather than get a near miss on many.Also¬†from a cost point of view any increased time in machining¬†stainless tube will probably be well offset by missing out the¬†bluing operation . Stainless is pretty universal for aftermarket chokes. The other ¬†thing is are your chokes Invector Plus ? ¬†( long but flush fitting) or the invector plus that stick out of the barrel a bit ¬†? ¬†If they are the internal type it doesn‚Äôt matter a monkey‚Äôs what colour they are¬†ūüėā. If they are the extended ones and you want an exact match in looks and colour go to Browning , or put a wanted add on here, many people sell original chokes when¬†they buy Briley or¬†Teague.¬†

Edited by MartynB

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El Spavo

Cheers Martyn, my chokes are the Inv+ which sit flush, so I take your point about they shouldn't be noticable... think I'm like others on here in that I'm likely to be a bit anal about one having that silver ring to it at the end which will bug me even though it soooo shouldn't! ūüėĄ Would it be a fair assumption to say that if it actually said Browning on it, it'll be the right ones or in the aftermarket is there a tendency for Browning to porn themselves out a bit so multiple manufacturers can just bung their name on it?

Had a look on US ebay and if you search 'Invector Plus 12' it seems to bring a load up which don't show on the UK ebay (mainly cos of shipping), and there's a fair whack of them which have Browning stamped on and look pretty much the same, so at a guess they'd be the same thing? They mainly seem to say New Old Stock, or similar so wondering if the Inv+ is now old hat despite my gun only being 3 years old: there's nothing on the current Browning pricelist for those chokes under those two above.numbers.

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Cosmicblue

When Browning put the blingy coloured rings on extended tubes they tended to mark the type with letters: 

1/2 - is M - Modified 

1/4 is IC - Improved Cylinder

There is a complete list here - including the notch coding for flush-fit chokes:

https://www.browning.com/news/tech-terms/choke-tube-identification.html

 

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MartynB

If you buy it as a Browning brand   invector plus  choke it will be be the same . It will have been made just the same as any other 525 choke that leaves the Miroku Factory .  .  If you buy an  aftermarket choke they are made by those people , as they all claim more magical properties than the factories , which of course is bollocks . Browning will not supply anyone else with their chokes to sell under a different name . Strange thing , eBay U.K. will not allow listings of anything they consider to be a working part of a firearm , and that includes chokes .   I’ve bought a few bits from the USA for fishing and shooting , and have had a bit of luck lately with not getting stung for customs clearance ( about £12 )  and tax ( total about 24% on the item cost and shipping )  , but be prepared for a real stuffing if you are unlucky .  For a choke I think  I’d just buy it in the UK . 

Personally I‚Äôd just buy 2 x 3/8 ¬†Teague chokes ( just ¬†because they are made in the UK by real British¬†engineers ! ) ¬†, then never bother with worrying about 1/4 or 1/2 or using the barrel selector¬†ūüėā¬†, but I can understand you wanting to keep it with all factory bits ¬†.¬†

 

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El Spavo

Cheers guys. Thanks Schmokinn but I'm currently looking at a pair of factory chokes, Mod & Imp Cyl and a choke key for about £20 the lot in the states! Anyone know what the score is with getting choke sand the like back to blighty though as I have a pilot mate who goes to the states regularly and some of the sellers just can't be arsed to post it outside the US, which is helpful of them, but he'd happily bring them back if it's just a case of sticking them in his luggage and explaining what they are if asked?

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schmokinn
1 minute ago, El Spavo said:

Cheers guys. Thanks Schmokinn but I'm currently looking at a pair of factory chokes, Mod & Imp Cyl and a choke key for about £20 the lot in the states! Anyone know what the score is with getting choke sand the like back to blighty though as I have a pilot mate who goes to the states regularly and some of the sellers just can't be arsed to post it outside the US, which is helpful of them, but he'd happily bring them back if it's just a case of sticking them in his luggage and explaining what they are if asked?

Can't see him being asked as they would pose no threat in any way,if you get them posted just get them described as threaded metal tubes...saves any need for somebody freaking out about guns.

what chokes do you actually have for your gun?

 

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timps

Just a word of caution Browning Invector +  have a different take on what they consider choke constriction should be compared to most aftermarket choke manufacturers.

Chokes have been measured in two ways for a long time.

The first way is pellet count in a circle at a set distance, and the physical constriction is matched to that but this varies widely depending on cartridge used .

The second and how Briley and most aftermarket choke manufactures market them is a percentage constriction of their interpretation of the average bore size. IC is always 0.010 constriction of the average bore size for them regardless for a 12 Bore.

What does this mean, well in the case of my Browning invector + chokes my aftermarket Brileys were physically tighter than standard Browning ones, ¬ľ was nearly a ¬Ĺ and ¬Ĺ was nearly ¬ĺ.

Browning go for 0.005" constriction for their Inv+  IC - 1/4 choke which is very open where as Briley, for example, go for 0.010" in line with what I would expect for an aftermarket choke IC- 1/4 choke. I doubt you would get any aftermarket choke manufacturer producing a 1/4 choke at 0.005" constriction so for Browning invector + it does seem to be a problem to get like for like just by using the designation written on the side. 

Beretta’s on the other hand seem to be more inline with Briley's or other aftermarket makes thinking on choke constriction.

So just be mindful if you buy a Briley or aftermarket ¬†¬ľ or ¬Ĺ it wouldn't¬† be the same physical constriction as the original invector +.

It is not that one is better than the other just different, but if you like how your OME invector + patterns don't expect the same results from aftermarket as they are physically tighter.

Edited by timps
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El Spavo

Good advice all,¬†but what I'm looking at are the same as what I already have, Browning inv+ chokes in blue metal, which came with the gun as new. Just a jolly to match a pair so I don't need to fanny about with the selector. ūüėä

Timps, I think that's what I was trying to avoid but I'm gonna have to presume that if i get the same looking choke, in the same time case, in the same colour, I'm gonna have to go with it being the same thing.

Frustrating but is some I've seen say Browning choke in all the right packaging... but with a made by briley sticker on the top! Go figure!

Edited by El Spavo

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El Spavo

Probably gonna be a moot point anyway as I don't know anyone happy to bring them back with them as they're not shotgun owners so just have that automatic twitch when they think about it.

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schmokinn

Are we talking about flush chokes as i don't think you have made it clear?

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Stigger

These are the standard Browning flush Invector + chokes and These are the Browning Midas extended chokes.

By the way, Briley make chokes for Browning, the Browning Midas chokes are made by Briley.

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El Spavo

Yeah, mentioned in post 3 they're flush chokes. ūüĎćūüŹĽ

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westley

I think you just maybe taking the whole choke thing a bit far.  Instead, forget about bloomin chokes and concentrate more on your shooting. If it helps in any way, I had a full set of extended Briley chokes for my Miroku (Inv plus) for some 10 years. I only used the 2 I/C chokes in all of that time. They were the extended type, for ease of removal for cleaning purposes. I was not really worried about the colour (I think it was silver) because I never saw the chokes when I was shooting the thing  !  I have recently bought a 525 20 bore. That has a full set of Browning chokes (flush variety) all in silver. I needed an extra I/C as there was only 1 supplied with the gun. After hours of wanted ads and searching, (you can not afford to do that for too long at my age  !) I contacted Chris Potter guns who supplied a Briley I/C flush choke in silver for £24. It was delivered the next day and has been in the gun since August. So, I have 1 Browning, I/C flush choke in silver and 1 Briley I/C  flush choke also in er...silver. I can honestly say that using my usual cartridges in either plastic or fibre wads, I am unable to tell the difference between either choke, judged on the breaks. I am also at a loss to say which choke is in which barrel. I am game shooting with the gun on Saturday and using my usual 25 gram 6's fibre wads, the chokes will remain the same.

My Browning 725 has a full set of DS chokes, all fitted with  pretty gold ring things.(on each end too).  Again they are extended and I have bought an extra I/C choke. The remaining chokes stay at home and are, as yet, unused. My Beretta 303 is also fitted with an extended Briley I/C choke, that too is er......silver (I think). I have found it pays to keep things simple, get into a routine and STICK to it  !  Good luck in sorting out your choke dilemma.

Edited by westley
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jwpzx9r

I was shooting training  FU with an instructor today and I have to say I was taking absolute liberties with the distance I was shooting the targets at. I was very deliberately waiting to shoot the target rather than flashing the barrels toward the target. Now I was completely vaporising most of the targets and I did not miss that many and any that were missed the instructor rest the tarp and the target was then broken first barrel... so in effect every target was broken. Now my gun is choked 1/2 and full... but wait a minute trap gun have to be 3/4 and full... not really the secret is actually being on target  as my re- shot targets proved. Just my opinion but I honestly think targets can be broken at silly distances with what may be regarded as too open a choke ... providing you are on target!

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westley
31 minutes ago, jwpzx9r said:

I was shooting training  FU with an instructor today and I have to say I was taking absolute liberties with the distance I was shooting the targets at. I was very deliberately waiting to shoot the target rather than flashing the barrels toward the target. Now I was completely vaporising most of the targets and I did not miss that many and any that were missed the instructor rest the tarp and the target was then broken first barrel... so in effect every target was broken. Now my gun is choked 1/2 and full... but wait a minute trap gun have to be 3/4 and full... not really the secret is actually being on target  as my re- shot targets proved. Just my opinion but I honestly think targets can be broken at silly distances with what may be regarded as too open a choke ... providing you are on target!

I have seen beginners shoot at a straight away DTL bird, using 24 grams in a Beretta 301 with no choke in the gun. They were the drop in variety and none came with the gun  !  As you rightly say, "When yer on em, yer on em "  !

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El Spavo

., ironically westley the reason I'd like to get them, and trust me it is purely a nicety, is so that I can have the same type in both barrel so it DOES take away any¬†difference and let me concentrate on the shooting. ūüėÉ even you said you only used the two i/c in all that time which is exactly what I'm trying to achieve. If I'm shooting the same both shots then I know any error can't even be 1% the gun, it's 100% me and I can move forward. ūüėä

Trust me, I'm too inexperienced and don't have a clue what real world difference one choke makes to another but until I know enough to change that if like everything to be equal if possible, that's all. How many times do you read on here people using the same choke in both cos it's very common from what I see.

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westley
22 hours ago, El Spavo said:

., ironically westley the reason I'd like to get them, and trust me it is purely a nicety, is so that I can have the same type in both barrel so it DOES take away any¬†difference and let me concentrate on the shooting. ūüėÉ even you said you only used the two i/c in all that time which is exactly what I'm trying to achieve. If I'm shooting the same both shots then I know any error can't even be 1% the gun, it's 100% me and I can move forward. ūüėä

Trust me, I'm too inexperienced and don't have a clue what real world difference one choke makes to another but until I know enough to change that if like everything to be equal if possible, that's all. How many times do you read on here people using the same choke in both cos it's very common from what I see.

Extremely common, an awful lot of experienced shooters use the same choke restriction in each barrel, whether or not they are the same make of choke,............well  ?  You probably will get a bigger difference from cartridge to cartridge than from choke to choke, regardless of what either Manufacturer or shooter, would have you believe.

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El Spavo

Absolutely, so it's keeping that chance of outside variables to a minimum.

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schmokinn
30 minutes ago, El Spavo said:

Absolutely, so it's keeping that chance of outside variables to a minimum.

i don't think you get it...forget what you perceive as variables,they will not make a toss of difference to your shooting at this stage.

Get on and learn to shoot (which you have to do physically) once you have mastered that then it may be worth considering what you perceive to be variables,but if you learn anything by then it will probably be that they don't matter very much if at all!

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El Spavo

No, I do get it, but my point was that if one takes even that possibility out, then it can focus the mind absolutely cos there's no other reason than one is a biff. :) No head games.

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