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Robden

What to do?

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Robden

For the last few months I have only shot DTL (my choice).

Being a tight wad I only shoot one barrel but when I get better I'll start using the second barrel. Shooting gun up I am only getting 12-14 from 25. But, gun down, I'm hitting 20-21. My instructor/tutor says that I'm making it hard for myself and should try to get used to gun up, and my scores will improve. I'll add, that he's not saying that I'm wrong, just his honest opinion. However I can see what he means, but TBH I feel more comfortable gun down (less thinking time to worry about direction and lead etc).

As yet, I've no intention of entering any competitions, I just want to be able to shoot well.  

So, what to do? Take his advice that I'm paying for, or carry on with what I feel more comfortable with - at the moment?

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Hamster

You have to be doing several things a good bit wrong to only be averaging 50% at DTL, the reason you're hitting more with gun down is almost certainly because you're spot shooting and not due to any material advantage of not pre-mounting for going away birds. 

Your instructor is right but it's also a puzzle as to why he hasn't quickly realised the main faults and pointed them out to you, these can vary from poor address, poor identification of soft focus initial pick up area, poor tempo, incorrect reaction (too fast movement is as bad as too deliberate/lazy), head lifting (easy to get away with this when spot shooting simple targets), etc, etc, etc........

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Will Hewland
1 hour ago, Robden said:

For the last few months I have only shot DTL (my choice).

Being a tight wad I only shoot one barrel but when I get better I'll start using the second barrel. Shooting gun up I am only getting 12-14 from 25. But, gun down, I'm hitting 20-21. My instructor/tutor says that I'm making it hard for myself and should try to get used to gun up, and my scores will improve. I'll add, that he's not saying that I'm wrong, just his honest opinion. However I can see what he means, but TBH I feel more comfortable gun down (less thinking time to worry about direction and lead etc).

As yet, I've no intention of entering any competitions, I just want to be able to shoot well.  

So, what to do? Take his advice that I'm paying for, or carry on with what I feel more comfortable with - at the moment?

I’m no trap expert and you can’t coach on a forum.. but what may be happening when you start gun up is you have a chance to swing upwards and go over the top. Gun down, you don’t and just manage to shoulder the gun to shoot at the clay. One thing is sure, no DTL champ shoots gun down, so I would try things gun up, but adjust your gun speed. It’s likely all about slowing down. Initially, try shooting just under the clay. If it works that pretty much tells you you are flicking above without realising.

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Robden

I see.

He has told me to slow down as there's plenty of time (about .25 of a second). This will make me smoother, which in turn, will make me quicker, which will give me more time........I think!              I was guilty of head lifting, especially the bird going to the right but not so much now, due to a slight foot alteration. It's vary rare that I miss high or in front.  

More practice tomorrow (only the third outing with this gun) so I think I'll spend it gun up and see how it goes.......either way though, it's great fun even if it is frustrating at times.

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jwpzx9r

A couple of things pop into my mind. Firstly , could have egg on my face here, I do not think you are allowed to shoot DTL gun down. Second thing is are you using a trap gun? As it could be that you cannot see over the gun properly and are lifting your head to see the target. Thirdly you have much more time than 0.25 seconds to shoot a DTL target it takes at least 0.1 just to see it properly! and these targets are quite a bit slower than UT and OT targets which it is not uncommon for shooters to take 0.5 to 0.75 seconds to shoot.

I am going out on a limb but this could be the problem. You are using a gun that does not let you see the target properly when you shoot gun up as the comb is too low for trap shooting... however when shooting gun down this is not a problem and you then shoulder the gun and shoot the target. My advice stick something on the comb to get your head higher and take your time when shooting these targets you have plenty of it. Look for the target and DO NOT MOVE YOUR GUN until you can see the target as a solid object then move the gun and shoot where you think the target is going while keeping the gun moving!! This is vitally important. One other thing use both barrels you want to know you are moving your gun when you take the first shot, if you get a second barrel break this is usually indicative that you are keeping it moving.

"It's vary rare that I miss high or in front." how do you know that ?   

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Robden
5 minutes ago, jwpzx9r said:

A couple of things pop into my mind. Firstly , could have egg on my face here, I do not think you are allowed to shoot DTL gun down. Second thing is are you using a trap gun? As it could be that you cannot see over the gun properly and are lifting your head to see the target. Thirdly you have much more time than 0.25 seconds to shoot a DTL target it takes at least 0.1 just to see it properly! and these targets are quite a bit slower than UT and OT targets which it is not uncommon for shooters to take 0.5 to 0.75 seconds to shoot.

I am going out on a limb but this could be the problem. You are using a gun that does not let you see the target properly when you shoot gun up as the comb is too low for trap shooting... however when shooting gun down this is not a problem and you then shoulder the gun and shoot the target. My advice stick something on the comb to get your head higher and take your time when shooting these targets you have plenty of it. Look for the target and DO NOT MOVE YOUR GUN until you can see the target as a solid object then move the gun and shoot where you think the target is going while keeping the gun moving!! This is vitally important. One other thing use both barrels you want to know you are moving your gun when you take the first shot, if you get a second barrel break this is usually indicative that you are keeping it moving.

"It's vary rare that I miss high or in front." how do you know that ?   

The instructor told me. When he stands behind me he can usually see where it's going. I think you can shoot DTL with your back to the targets if you want to. Not sure though.😀 

You could be correct about the gun as when I first started this gun down malarky, it was with a sporter, but have just bought a Miroku MK 38 trap, so will see how it goes tomorrow.

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jwpzx9r
54 minutes ago, Robden said:

When he stands behind me he can usually see where it's going.

I have no doubt he has a way of assessing where you are shooting in relation to the target ... but I have yet to meet anybody who can actually see the shot fired from a shotgun with the naked eye. As to the position of when shooting I think you will find you need to be facing the trap house and have the gun in your shoulder when you call for the target. It is a very definite advantage to have the gun in your shoulder when you shoot ... when you come to shoot UT and OT the targets are much faster and have to shot gun up.

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westley
2 hours ago, jwpzx9r said:

A couple of things pop into my mind. Firstly , could have egg on my face here, I do not think you are allowed to shoot DTL gun down. Second thing is are you using a trap gun? As it could be that you cannot see over the gun properly and are lifting your head to see the target. Thirdly you have much more time than 0.25 seconds to shoot a DTL target it takes at least 0.1 just to see it properly! and these targets are quite a bit slower than UT and OT targets which it is not uncommon for shooters to take 0.5 to 0.75 seconds to shoot.

I am going out on a limb but this could be the problem. You are using a gun that does not let you see the target properly when you shoot gun up as the comb is too low for trap shooting... however when shooting gun down this is not a problem and you then shoulder the gun and shoot the target. My advice stick something on the comb to get your head higher and take your time when shooting these targets you have plenty of it. Look for the target and DO NOT MOVE YOUR GUN until you can see the target as a solid object then move the gun and shoot where you think the target is going while keeping the gun moving!! This is vitally important. One other thing use both barrels you want to know you are moving your gun when you take the first shot, if you get a second barrel break this is usually indicative that you are keeping it moving.

"It's vary rare that I miss high or in front." how do you know that ?   

NO, I think you could do an Irish jig between shots, IF you felt so inclined, and nobody would bother.  BUT bring an auto onto the line and ...................................flippin eck, watch out  !

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Wonko the Sane

In conjunction with what John had to say I'd suggest exploring a consistent gun mount and some knowledgeable person assisting with gun fit since it does not seem that you understand that (like most Limeys it seems  :wink:)

You might also consider consulting the writings of Michael Yardley, one of your own, who does have some fine methods described to attend to gun fit.

just a thot 

Edited by Wonko the Sane

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Robden
1 hour ago, Wonko the Sane said:

In conjunction with what John had to say I'd suggest exploring a consistent gun mount and some knowledgeable person assisting with gun fit since it does not seem that you understand that (like most Limeys it seems  :wink:)

You might also consider consulting the writings of Michael Yardley, one of your own, who does have some fine methods described to attend to gun fit.

just a thot 

I AM NOT A LIMEY!!!!!! And anyway what the hell is a "thot"? 😁

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balltrap
2 minutes ago, Robden said:

I AM NOT A LIMEY!!!!!! And anyway what the hell is a "thot"? 😁

And just what is wrong with being a LIMEY ! and i have thots of my own ☺️

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Robden
16 minutes ago, balltrap said:

And just what is wrong with being a LIMEY ! and i have thots of my own ☺️

Some of my best friends are Limeys but not a thot among them. 😀

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balltrap
16 minutes ago, Robden said:

Some of my best friends are Limeys but not a thot among them. 😀

They must have a few thots, them yanks do not give a thot about owt

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Wonko the Sane

As you all may or may not know, in my quest to be a perfectly lovely person one of my main goals is to not unnecessarily offend.  I consider  Limey to be something of a term of endearment and most certainly didn't intend to be in any way hurtful.  There are a number of persons on this forum that I would like to consider friends tho we will likely never actually meet, and I have no doubt that they are Limeys.  And tho many generations removed there are Limeys circulating in my DNA still.

So a big virtual hug for all of you whether you have thots or not

 

bloody Limeys

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billybang
1 hour ago, Wonko the Sane said:

As you all may or may not know, in my quest to be a perfectly lovely person one of my main goals is to not unnecessarily offend.  I consider  Limey to be something of a term of endearment and most certainly didn't intend to be in any way hurtful.  There are a number of persons on this forum that I would like to consider friends tho we will likely never actually meet, and I have no doubt that they are Limeys.  And tho many generations removed there are Limeys circulating in my DNA still.

So a big virtual hug for all of you whether you have thots or not

 

bloody Limeys

And a big hug back Wonko I can see the English gentleman trying to get out 🤗 

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Robden
2 hours ago, billybang said:

And a big hug back Wonko I can see the English gentleman trying to get out 🤗 

"Mmmm!" Maybe you two should get a room......and thot together. :rofl:

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Gavin

It's possible  your aiming (looking with the gun)  when shooting gun up.  Also gun up  can show minor eye dominance issues  as the eyes come back to the rib.  Keep your eyes out on clay  and trust it 

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Salopian

Could everyone please ignore Charlie's ( Wonko's) post on Gunfit.

It is a simple fact that as far as shotgunning is concerned Americans know the square root of F'all about gunfit , he even acknowledges that Yardley is an Expert .

Give over Yankee.😂

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Wonko the Sane
On 8/24/2018 at 11:27 PM, Salopian said:

Could everyone please ignore Charlie's ( Wonko's) post on Gunfit.

It is a simple fact that as far as shotgunning is concerned Americans know the square root of F'all about gunfit , he even acknowledges that Yardley is an Expert .

Give over Yankee.😂

HAHAHAHA!!!  That's cos Yardley (and I didn't call him an "Expert") talks about gun fit JUST LIKE coaches/gun fit people in the US do.  Most people seriously shooting international games do approach the topic in a similar manner.  Take a look at the Italian's methodology - - - OMG!!!!  It's the same thing!!!

 Perhaps you should all go back and read Churchill - he had it pretty much covered half a century ago.  :poke:

 

meathead

Edited by Wonko the Sane

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