abt changes alledgedly

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ips

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Jul 19, 2012
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I hear rumours of further changes to abt target presentation, anyone know the full story ?

 
Heard similar  angles in a bit and slightly less distance.  

 
sounds like were going back to old abt then and thank the lord. Maybe the powers that be have been reading our posts.

 
May have been a dream (or nightmare - delete as appropriate) but I seem to recall that I heard FITASC may be taking it over ....allegedly  :rolleyes:

DT

 
May have been a dream (or nightmare - delete as appropriate) but I seem to recall that I heard FITASC may be taking it over ....allegedly  :rolleyes:

DT
I think FITASC had it back in the 80's, but I could be wrong! As it is right now it's little more than single trap OT but with hold points according to peg number. I would love to see the old BALL TRAP come back. 

I hear rumours of further changes to abt target presentation, anyone know the full story ?
Anyway, who the hell is it that decides such things? AND....why don't they consult any of us grass roots shooters BEFORE they change things?

 
I've got a feeling wires might be getting crossed.  

Peter Croft, President of BICTSF, was asked by FITASC in September 2013 to look at ABT rules, which as Automatic Trap, was an ISSF discipline but has been quietly dropped from their rule book. Allegedly he's finally produced something which is going to be demonstrated next month in Italy when the Palinkas 'snake' system for UT is going to be demonstrated too.

From what I've heard it's proposed the distance and angles will be reduced, possibly shooting stands back on a arc and maybe even 24gm cartridges. 

If approved then it'll become a new FITASC discipline, something simpler than UT.    

 
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Yes they were reduced from 45 to 32.5 degrees plus or minus 2.5 two years ago.

Bit of a daft figure really as angleometers are in 5 degree segments.

 
If the "snake" system actually gets the go a head I will consider packing it all up to be honest. I will move on to OT full time, the notion that queuing up to shoot is a good way of perfecting a shooting setup and being consistent is ,I think, very strange. 

 
I've got a feeling wires might be getting crossed.  

Peter Croft, President of BICTSF, was asked by FITASC in September 2013 to look at ABT rules, which as Automatic Trap, was an ISSF discipline but has been quietly dropped from their rule book. Allegedly he's finally produced something which is going to be demonstrated next month in Italy when the Palinkas 'snake' system for UT is going to be demonstrated too.

From what I've heard its proposed the distance and angles will be reduced, possibly shooting stands back on a arc and maybe even 24gm cartridges. 

If approved then it'll become a new FITASC discipline, something simpler than UT.    
Well I hope that Pete Croft will sort the ABT , he knows well enough about how it used to be a good stepping stone between DTL and the faster stuff. Personally I can't see a problem with bringing back the arc to ABT and 24grm shells should not be a problem either. But Phil......what in the name of god is the Palinkas snake ??? 

 
Palinkas wants to do away with squads shooting UT and just have a continuous line of shooters going through. They've introduced it to Compak Sporting. His reasoning is it'll be quicker and therefore a greater number of entries could be taken. This of course means that FITASC will make more lovely money and sod the shooters.

 
Palinkas wants to do away with squads shooting UT and just have a continuous line of shooters going through. They've introduced it to Compak Sporting. His reasoning is it'll be quicker and therefore a greater number of entries could be taken. This of course means that FITASC will make more lovely money and sod the shooters.
I would humbly disagree that more will shoot it. Our last club comp had 79 competitors to shoot 100 targets each over the day introduce that "snake" cack and you will cut the numbers not increase them! They may introduce it at international level bat I see very few club down here that would want to go down that road.

 
Palinkas wants to do away with squads shooting UT and just have a continuous line of shooters going through. They've introduced it to Compak Sporting. His reasoning is it'll be quicker and therefore a greater number of entries could be taken. This of course means that FITASC will make more lovely money and sod the shooters.
Ah, thanks Phil. Sounds barmy, well unless you are the one getting the cash of course. Lets hope they leave UT alone and give us our ball trap back.

 
I would humbly disagree that more will shoot it. Our last club comp had 79 competitors to shoot 100 targets each over the day introduce that "snake" cack and you will cut the numbers not increase them! They may introduce it at international level bat I see very few club down here that would want to go down that road.
When Palinkas tried to bulldozer it through the UT Technical Commission in 2013 by threatening us we all resigned en masse with the exception of the Italian member.  The members of the TC are all shooters and realised the effect his harebrained notion would have on UT. Numbers are falling because the entry fee at €210 is exceedingly expensive when there's no prize money or article prizes and just the cheapest of the cheap cups it means the events aren't good value for shooters. Unfortunately Palinkas can't grasp that, and doesn't like hearing the message he's wrong, especially when it is done so publicly as we did it.

The computer control boxes will all require new chips to operate the system, certainly some ranges will require building work undertaken to enable the snake to enter near peg one and depart near peg five.  In addition there'll need to be somewhere for the snake to line up outside each range.  The noise a couple of individuals yapping whilst waiting outside a range regularly causes shooting to be halted whilst the referee tells the miscreants to shut up, imagine 50 foreigners giving it large whilst you're trying to shoot.

 
i think Palinkas needs to focus his attention on those shooters that actually do turn up at European and World Championship FITASC events rather than those that don't.

Yes, the entry fee is a bit steep for what is essentially just a 200 target shoot but hey, it's a European or World Championship event! Surely there is lots of added expense as there is a lot of organisation required, venues to pay for, numerous referees to be flown in and accommodated, the FITASC big wigs to fly in and accommodate, etc, etc and let's not forget the incredibly generous Shooters goody bags....NOT! Based on my experience of the Euro/world UT this year I would rather they did not bother at all rather than be presented with a brochure for Corsiva Clays (when am I ever going to buy boxes of clays?) and a pack of playing cards (euros) or a stuffed toy cat (worlds). WTF! I mean WTF use is a stuffed cat to anybody over the age of three ? Who ever sat in that particular committee meeting and said "yep, this a world championship event and I like the idea of stuffed cat as a gift to the shooters. Order 400 immediately" wants sacking...or worse.....immediately! What planet do these people live on? Nothing, and I mean nothing would have been better recieved than that stuffed cat! 

I suspect that 99.9999999% of the competitors at either championship event would been content with a unique stock sticker like those presented at ISSF events. Probably cost 10p each.........so probably about the same as the stuffed cat then!

And as for the Palinkas Snake? If I'd wanted to join a queue to shoot I would have taken up sporting! They really don't get it do they? 

DT

ps: the Granada cat is currently on death row awaiting a suitable execution location fo death by firing squad. All of which will be videoed and posted on YouTube.

 
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Goody bags are provided by the federation or shooting ground and I agree mostly they're carp. 

The only reason the FITASC bigwig Palinkas jetted in for one day was he'd been informed the Technical Commission had chucked out the proposal of the World Championships to be in Morocco next year. He managed to placate them with an offer of coaches being provided from the airport to hotels and daily transport from hotels to the shooting range. He even mentioned providing armed guards front and rear on each one.

He only shows his face at UT events when there trouble.  Having spent ten years on the TC I'm well versed with his antics. 

 
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Goody bags are provided by the federstion or shooting ground and I agree mostly they're carp. 

The only reason the FITASC bigwig Palinkas jetted in for one day was he'd been informed the Technical Commission had chucked out the proposal of the World Championships to be in Morocco next year. He managed to placate them with an offer of coaches being provided from the airport to hotels and daily transport from hotels to the shooting range. He even mentioned providing armed guards front and rear on each one.

He only shows his face at UT events when there trouble.  Having spent ten years on the TC I'm well versed with his antics. 
he may well have placated the UT TC regarding Morocco. Now all he has to do is persuade the competitors to go! This family 'TC' is definitely sitting firmly on the fence at present, as are a lot of other potential team members. The prospect of plane, airport, coach, hotel, coach, shooting ground, coach, hotel, coach, shooting ground, coach, hotel, shooting ground, coach, airport, plane, home doesn't fill me will glee I must say.

DT

 
he may well have placated the UT TC regarding Morocco. Now all he has to do is persuade the competitors to go! This family 'TC' is definitely sitting firmly on the fence at present, as are a lot of other potential team members. The prospect of plane, airport, coach, hotel, coach, shooting ground, coach, hotel, coach, shooting ground, coach, hotel, shooting ground, coach, airport, plane, home doesn't fill me will glee I must say.

DT
We shot the World Champs in Tangier in 2007, Kevin Borley won with a 199, straight up to his 196th target. The shooting ground was fabulous, once you left the shooting ground and the electric security gates closed behind you the rest of it was pretty awful.

We stayed in a major chain hotel just off the seafront, that was fine and to be honest in the hotel you wouldn't have known what country you were in. We were advised by the hotel staff not to walk around the neighbourhood alone and carry or wear valuables, needless to say we did go out in small groups but it wasn't a pleasant experience.  John Heading was the team manager and he arranged a coach as transport for us from airport arrival until departure, so we didn't have to experience first hand some of the death defying driving techniques of the locals we watched from the safety of the coach.

It was a poorly supported event, not only because it was Morocco but it was across water.  The vast majority of individual entrants are quite happy to drive a 1000km or more through several countries to get to a shoot but not to fly or take a ferry.  Every island event, and I include the UK and other continents in that, have poorly subcribed entries in comparison to mainland Europe.  The most popular events are those near coastal resorts, or at a place they haven't been held before, or for sometime. 

 

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